Images from Hospital visit...for C&C

[Stagecoach]

Mike,

I also did one but taken from the sheets, slightly different but we know why.

What has struck me with this image as strange is what is causing the difference in wall shade to the left of the plastic bottle if you look within the hanging loop of the plastic pipe and below it.

There must be a very simple explanation.

[Mike Buckley]

I also did one but taken from the sheets, slightly different but we know why.

I wasn't able to get anything satisfactory to me eye using the sheets as a sample. I settled on using a grey tone in one of the medical devises attached to the wall. I often find using a grey tone as a sample is more effective than using a white or black tone.

I forgot to mention that when there are mixed light sources, I like to place a white balance (neutrally spectral) card in the area of the scene that is most important to get the white balance right. This scene is a great example of that.

What has struck me with this image as strange is what is causing the difference in wall shade to the left of the plastic bottle if you look within the hanging loop of the plastic pipe and below it.

There must be a very simple explanation.

I also noticed that. My guess is that that area is affected by a graduated mixture of at least two light sources. Not easy to perfectly correct during post-processing.

[IzzieK]

Grahame and Mike...there were three sources of lights in the that room -- one emanating from the two computer screens, I think most the blue background of Windows or something, the overhead tungsten light and the window light (where the blinds were shut actually)...so the mixture of colours. In the first (equipment) and second (garden) images I used a simple WB -- cool colour filters from the adjustment layers (because it is a quickie job...) but the second and third ones I used another method I forgot now what it was. I can use a third and fourth method using the threshold too and the white/black points by adding the grey and white layers then adjusting the image via the curves adjustment but it will take a lot to experiment on that so I just used the cooling filters and pick the best from the three. Sorry, I was in a hurry...and oh I forgot about the reflection of the light from the door where there was a half open hanging fabric they shut when the patient needed to dress or undressed. We were in a single though smallist private room but they still have that fabric by the door so the patient can have privacy while dressing up. That light reflection from the outside that huge hallway with large bright windows contributes much to the light too in a compact room hence the use of cooling filters there...a quickie solution.

[Stagecoach]

Thanks for the explanation Izzie of how you reached your result with the WB on No 1. It's one of those scenes that's not straightforward due to the lighting and in reality if its just a snap more than likely not worth spending much time on. Even just moving around with the WB picker in ACR there's so many 'slightly' different results from white and grey surfaces the best one is what pleases you

I'm still baffled by what has caused the difference in wall shade in the area C to D when A to B is as would be expected



Grahame

[deetheturk]

Thanks for making me laugh, again, your a nutter lol, all the best to Bill, nice captures too!

[Mike Buckley]

I prefer Grahame's overall appearance over mine. To be more precise, I prefer the colors in his version on everything except the white pillow cases and sheets. So, for me, the ideal and quite time-consuming solution would be to use my white balance and then fine tune all of the objects in the scene by selectively altering the color balance in those areas. However, if I had Grahame's version to begin with, I would simply alter the color balance on the pillow cases and sheets.

Izzie,

I noticed that you shot the scenes using Manual white balance. The Auto white balance on your Nikon D810 is so good that you might want to consider using it. I use it on my D7000 about 99% of the time and it works fine about 99% of the time. Naturally, it won't work properly throughout an entire scene when there are multiple light sources but no white balance setting will.

I also noticed that the images posted here are in AdobeRGB color space. If there are people still using an old browser that is not color-managed or in the more likely situation of people using a browser that is poorly color-managed, they won't see the same colors you see. If I remember correctly, there are very few monitors that display the full gamut of AdobeRGB, so that's another reason not to use it for display on the Internet. To solve all of those issues, I highly recommend that you use the sRGB color space for photos displayed on the Internet.

[KimC]

Love the story and images that go along... Wishing Bill a speedy recovery!

[IzzieK]

I understand your effort at making the whites, white, Grahame, but the walls of the room that we were, was not really straight clinical white as your edit depicted here, hence the pillow and pillow case almost got blown out. The wall is really creamy white or dirty white, maybe somewhere in the middle? Thank you for your edit...it makes me scare to stay in a totally white walled room. It reminded me of the house I bought in Oz that has white walls and white carpets, smelling of Clorox...the thought of who died in that house was killing me... I bought it because it looks sturdy enough to withstand high wind catastrophes during the changes of season then had it bulldozed and started all over again...

Thanks for the explanation Izzie of how you reached your result with the WB on No 1. It's one of those scenes that's not straightforward due to the lighting and in reality if its just a snap more than likely not worth spending much time on. Even just moving around with the WB picker in ACR there's so many 'slightly' different results from white and grey surfaces the best one is what pleases you

I'm still baffled by what has caused the difference in wall shade in the area C to D when A to B is as would be expected



Grahame

[IzzieK]

I prefer Grahame's overall appearance over mine. To be more precise, I prefer the colors in his version on everything except the white pillow cases and sheets. So, for me, the ideal and quite time-consuming solution would be to use my white balance and then fine tune all of the objects in the scene by selectively altering the color balance in those areas. However, if I had Grahame's version to begin with, I would simply alter the color balance on the pillow cases and sheets.

White is a difficult colour (or non-colour) to deal with...for me that is...but I like though for some reason, as a woman, I always think that it is hard to clean or keep clean.

Izzie,

I noticed that you shot the scenes using Manual white balance. The Auto white balance on your Nikon D810 is so good that you might want to consider using it. I use it on my D7000 about 99% of the time and it works fine about 99% of the time. Naturally, it won't work properly throughout an entire scene when there are multiple light sources but no white balance setting will.

OK...thanks...I will try that. In fact, I have just changed to Auto-WB...another thing not to have to deal with while shooting but will check my histogram after each shot to see what is going on, if it is OK or not for the kind of shoot that I am doing, maybe good for indoor shots so I do not have to worry about it...I am all over the place when it comes to WB because I prefer Cloudy and did not know if I was going to change it to Shady or something because I was doing indoor shooting and then the garden was also in the shade so I left it as is...I have been studying Kelvin but I haven't applied it yet in other places than inside the house and outside my deck...

I also noticed that the images posted here are in AdobeRGB color space. If there are people still using an old browser that is not color-managed or in the more likely situation of people using a browser that is poorly color-managed, they won't see the same colors you see. If I remember correctly, there are very few monitors that display the full gamut of AdobeRGB, so that's another reason not to use it for display on the Internet. To solve all of those issues, I highly recommend that you use the sRGB color space for photos displayed on the Internet.

This paragraph is really interesting that is why I told Bill I will be busy for a while...My Photoshop is configured to Pro-Photo at 360 dpi (what my printer is...) My camera is configured at the Shooting Menu as SRGB. Then when I go to Photoshop when editing, my image mode is configured to 16 bits, RGB...so where did you see the AdobeRGB. I tried to find it in my EXIF but it wasn't there...I have the same EXIF as Grahame's edit but the only change was that his software is Photoshop CC and mine is Photoshop CS6. I tried to find even just a sort of reference to AdobeRGB, I can't find it...can you please tell me how to come to this???

Thanks...

[IzzieK]

Love the story and images that go along... Wishing Bill a speedy recovery!

Thank you for passing by Kim...Bill is healing very well, thanks...he is a born worrier so I need to entertain him every now and then. I truly appreciate your comment...

[ST1]

Izzie I'm sorry I come to this a little late, some may say better late than never; others may tell the truth .
I do hope Bill is on the mend and still suffering in silence I wouldn't want your brain waves being disturbed any more that they are in your normal day to day existence.
I find this thread to be very informative especially around the white balance edits the others have contributed with, so thank you for kicking the tread off and to the other contributors who added to it.

Should you wish to have some more hospital practice sessions I have a tentative theatre trip scheduled for mid August. Maybe you could fly over for the day. I doubt they will allow you in the operating theatre but you could have a retail therapy session with SWMBO .
Mind you my wallet will be out of bounds

[Mike Buckley]

where did you see the AdobeRGB. I tried to find it in my EXIF but it wasn't there

A screen shot of my cataloging software that displays the color space in the bottom right corner is shown below.

I tried to find even just a sort of reference to AdobeRGB, I can't find it...can you please tell me how to come to this???

Look no further than this CiC tutorial. It contains a link to another tutorial that compares sRGB with AdobeRGB. Also Google AdobeRGB color space for tons of information.

[IzzieK]

Thanks for making me laugh, again, your a nutter lol, all the best to Bill, nice captures too!

Thanks, pal...you must understand that sometimes I can be a stand - up comedian. Maybe I was in the wrong career path when I was working...

Thank you....at last you poked your head down my way to look at my shots....did I give you a headache? Sorry...

[IzzieK]

Izzie I'm sorry I come to this a little late, some may say better late than never; others may tell the truth .

There is no late here on this side of the fence...while you were sleeping, I snuck in my shots...

I do hope Bill is on the mend and still suffering in silence I wouldn't want your brain waves being disturbed any more that they are in your normal day to day existence.

He will live...it is just one of those very simple procedures that should have been a long time ago and he kept postponing it done one way or the other until his doctor gave him an ultimatum that made him cave in...

I find this thread to be very informative especially around the white balance edits the others have contributed with, so thank you for kicking the tread off and to the other contributors who added to it.

Should you wish to have some more hospital practice sessions I have a tentative theatre trip scheduled for mid August. Maybe you could fly over for the day. I doubt they will allow you in the operating theatre but you could have a retail therapy session with SWMBO .
Mind you my wallet will be out of bounds

Thanks for the invite...actually I am the kind who really hate shopping until necessary. I have a ton of hand me downs from my daughter for clothes which are really very nice and soft and several box full of shoes I will never see the light of for over 4 years and make-up that will just go to the bin after over 6 months of non-use. Even when I was working, my uniform are jeans and tennis shoes because they are comfortable. Let me loose in a shopping centre or the new tourissy brand outlet mall and I will sit in a corner of a restaurant and whip my camera out instead. Not that I take good shots, but they are passable. Now I aim for shots that are not just passable anymore, thanks to CiC.

I appreciate your feedback and comments and if I were you, I'd give your wife a camera to take shots of you when you go to hospital next. That will be interesting...

[IzzieK]

But Mike...I had already told you what options I use in my camera, and editing software...and I had refused to use AdobeRGB in any of my settings since I acquired that Photoshop book of Martin Evening's Photoshop for Photographers. By looking at the image you posted it must be a wrong setting...as it is nowhere near the setting options I set for Photoshop nor my camera.

Thank you very much for what I had learned from this post. It was most interesting. I really do appreciate your input...and enjoyed reading your conversation with Grahame about White Balance.

A screen shot of my cataloging software that displays the color space in the bottom right corner is shown below.





Look no further than this CiC tutorial. It contains a link to another tutorial that compares sRGB with AdobeRGB. Also Google AdobeRGB color space for tons of information.

[Cantab]

But Mike...I had already told you what options I use in my camera, and editing software...and I had refused to use AdobeRGB in any of my settings since I acquired that Photoshop book of Martin Evening's Photoshop for Photographers. By looking at the image you posted it must be a wrong setting...as it is nowhere near the setting options I set for Photoshop nor my camera.

Thank you very much for what I had learned from this post. It was most interesting. I really do appreciate your input...and enjoyed reading your conversation with Grahame about White Balance.

Izzie, I use the Prophoto colour space for eveything until I'm preparing an image to be posted on the internet. I then make a jpeg copy in the sRGB colour space, for the reasons Mike set out: the colours are more likely to appear as they should be for those viewing the picture on the internet via a web browser.

[IzzieK]

Izzie, I use the Prophoto colour space for eveything until I'm preparing an image to be posted on the internet. I then make a jpeg copy in the sRGB colour space, for the reasons Mike set out: the colours are more likely to appear as they should be for those viewing the picture on the internet via a web browser.

Thanks Bruce...I learn something each day...I was just confused as to why his colour management says that I am using AdobeRGB when all my settings indicated I am not hence my comment because I am confused...My colour setting in PCS6 is actually SRGB. I captured my Colour Settings from Photoshop...here it is...



Do you think I should change the first option to Monitor Screen instead??

[bnnrcn]

What a long thread! Sorry for posting a bit late Isabel . I just want to say that I wish the best for Bill I don't want to comment on the images as hospitals don't remind me nice things.

[Mike Buckley]

Izzie,

I don't use PCS, so I don't understand the details of your screen shot. However, it seems to me that the "working spaces" are the color spaces being used while you are editing the image and the "color management policies" are the color spaces that are saved to the image file. So, in your configuration, I suspect that the color space that was in the file prior to opening it in PCS is being embedded in it when you save your edits regardless of the color space that is being used while you make the edits. It would be a good idea for you or someone to confirm or correct my thinking about that.

[Dave Humphries]

I am really no expert on colour spaces, but from what little I do know ...

If you are processing RAW shots from the camera, the colour space it has set is largely irrelevant - it mainly affects the in-camera jpgs.

If you were using Nikon software to process images (you are not), Nikon's RAW converter might well recognise the camera setting and apply it to any TIF or jpg produced from the RAW image.

However, (as far as I know) Adobe, in LR and/or ACR in PS CS6 will not. I believe they will apply another setting that I believe may be specific to the LR/ACR and different from what's in PS CS6 (particularly with respect to image exporting from CS6) - but now I am mainly guessing.

So this may help explain what's happening in regard to colour spaces (even if I am partially mistaken).


The difference in the shade of the wall at the places identified by Graham's A, B, C vs D is perplexing - I'm sure I have noticed something similar (ages ago) in one of my own shots, it made my head hurt, so I am in denial - it never happened
It begs the question: what do you mean 'the camera never lies'?

Cheers, Dave