Downgrading from D5100 - RX100, LX10, IPhone 11pro?

[SamRothstein]

I’m sure this will be controversial and an unpopular move, but I’m a believer in the “the best camera is the one you have with you” mentality. That being said, I need to figure out what the best camera to have with me is!


I’m currently recalculating my photography reality. My old reality included a Nikon d5100 with the 18-55mm kit lens and a Sigma 18-200 zoom. I mostly kept the 18-200 on when traveling, and used the 18-55 for around the house with the kids. My usual focal lengths were typically 18, 35, 55, and 80mm, rarely farther than 80mm. This gear is now sold, after sitting in the basement without being touched for over a year. Every hike, vacation, trip to the park or wherever, the thought of hauling that camera plus two small children was daunting. The thought of processing those photos (I currently have Photoshop Essentials) is also daunting and consumes more time than I have available. The iPhone 8+ was adequate, and always there.

The problem with the cell phone is the obvious downgrade in IQ, but also the lack of mindfulness. When I’m out and about with just the phone in my pocket, looking for scenes isn’t a priority, and when I do think to take a photo, it’s a quick snap without much setup. The ability to make adjustments immediately afterwards is also a plus.

My main focus in photography is my kids, and travel - land/cityscapes. I like being in cities and I do print the occasional 3/4x5 and sometimes 8x10. I’d like to eventually grab a great landscape I can print on a 20” canvas or metal sheet, but that’s not a main goal. My max budget is $600.

So now I’m looking to get a great jeans pocketable camera, and have honed in on the Sony RX100 line, Panasonic LX10 or ZS100, or evening upgrading to the iPhone 11pro. I’m leaning towards the cameras vs the phone because of the aforementioned “mindfulness”, larger sensors and a true zoom.

I’ve read plenty of reviews on each, seen threads here and elsewhere, but I still can’t make up my mind. Plz help!

[davidedric]

I've just taken delivery of an RX100 vii. I'm going away for a few days at the end of the week- I'll let you know how I get on. I'll be measuring it against my m4/3, which will be staying at home.

I appreciate the vii is outside your budget, but it might give some kind of indication.

[Manfred M]

This suggests to me that you are really looking at two different camera types;

1. A compact (the Sony RX100 series or the Panasonic LX10 or ZS100) with a 1" sensor; and

2. A camera phone.

None of these are going to be particularly well suited for the larger prints you might looking at. Frankly, the Nikon D5100 that you sold was the only one that would give you a half-way decent metal print at 20" size. Canvas is a lot more forgiving than metal, so the Panasonic and Sony cameras might work there. All of them will be fine for the traditional paper prints, other than the iPhone.

Panasonic traditionally makes a more robust product than the Sony at a slightly lower price point. Sony tends to position itself as a premium product and all of their equipment tends to sell at a higher price point than most of the competition. If you are looking for value, I would not consider the Sony, given your budget. Regardless, go for the smallest body that fits in your pocket. You are not going to use it unless you have it along.

Frankly, I don't think your issue is the camera, but rather your "mindfulness". That's not an equipment issue, but rather something you need to conquer. I would suggest sticking with your current iPhone and get the best you can out of it before spending any money on a replacement. Once you have reached the limits of what you can achieve with your current iPhone, you will be in a much better position to figure out what your camera needs are. Given the fact that printing does not seem at the top of your list, work on the other aspects of photography first....

[xpatUSA]

So now I’m looking to get a great jeans pocketable camera, and have honed in on the Sony RX100 line, Panasonic LX10 or ZS100 ...

I bought an LX7 new-in-box for the Wife who hardly ever used it and I only once or twice. Very cheap compared to eBay's "sold" listings! PM me if interested.

It has the excellent 'Leica' f/1.4 lens, see:

https://www.dpreview.com/reviews/pan...-lumix-dmc-lx7
.

[rpcrowe]

My main problem (certainly not the only problem but, definitely the main problem) in using a cell phone for photography is shooting the images using the LCD. I have terrible problems viewing my images especially outdoors in bright sun, using a cell phone. The problem is so bad, that I just don't use the phone for photography very often.

I also don't like the mini compact digital cameras that do not incorporate an eye level viewfinder,

However, I am quite comfortable in viewing my subject using the LCD when I am shooting in studio conditions with studio flash as the lighting and in subdued ambient lighting conditions.

The Sony A7iii with real time Eye AF combined with AFC makes it easier for me to shoot in a studio using the LCD as my viewfinder.

[DanK]

The main issue for me would be control. A phone allows you very little control. A good pocketable camera does.

It has been years since I went through the process of picking a small, carry-me-everywhere camera, so my knowledge is dated. However, I can point out a few things to consider:

-- if I'm right, the lumix lx-10 lacks a build int eye-level viewfinder. That's a deal-breaker for me.
-- sony keeps its old models on the market, so there are a bunch of RX 100 models to choose from. The newest are well beyond your budget.
--when I was looking, what deterred me from buying an RX 100 is that it has few controls. You have to burrow through menus to do much of anything. On the positive side, that's one way they keep it small. On the negative side, this makes it cumbersome to make changes.

For these reasons, i ended up with something that wouldn't serve your purposes: an LX-100. It has a bigger sensor and excellent controls. however, while I can fit it into a jacket pocket or a fanny pack, it's far too big for a shirt pocket.

[SamRothstein]

The main issue for me would be control. A phone allows you very little control. A good pocketable camera does.

It has been years since I went through the process of picking a small, carry-me-everywhere camera, so my knowledge is dated. However, I can point out a few things to consider:

-- if I'm right, the lumix lx-10 lacks a build int eye-level viewfinder. That's a deal-breaker for me.
-- sony keeps its old models on the market, so there are a bunch of RX 100 models to choose from. The newest are well beyond your budget.
--when I was looking, what deterred me from buying an RX 100 is that it has few controls. You have to burrow through menus to do much of anything. On the positive side, that's one way they keep it small. On the negative side, this makes it cumbersome to make changes.

For these reasons, i ended up with something that wouldn't serve your purposes: an LX-100. It has a bigger sensor and excellent controls. however, while I can fit it into a jacket pocket or a fanny pack, it's far too big for a shirt pocket.

Man that LX100 is one I’ve been eyeballing as well, but it does seem a bit too chunky for comfortable pocketability. With phone/keys/wallet already fighting for space, something like that would have to find a home in a back pocket for sure. But then I suppose any of the ones I’m looking at would be in the same pocket. I suppose I’m lucky in that in Chicago we only have a few months of weather that don’t need some kind of hoodie or jacket

[SamRothstein]

This suggests to me that you are really looking at two different camera types;

1. A compact (the Sony RX100 series or the Panasonic LX10 or ZS100) with a 1" sensor; and

2. A camera phone.

None of these are going to be particularly well suited for the larger prints you might looking at. Frankly, the Nikon D5100 that you sold was the only one that would give you a half-way decent metal print at 20" size. Canvas is a lot more forgiving than metal, so the Panasonic and Sony cameras might work there. All of them will be fine for the traditional paper prints, other than the iPhone.

Panasonic traditionally makes a more robust product than the Sony at a slightly lower price point. Sony tends to position itself as a premium product and all of their equipment tends to sell at a higher price point than most of the competition. If you are looking for value, I would not consider the Sony, given your budget. Regardless, go for the smallest body that fits in your pocket. You are not going to use it unless you have it along.

Frankly, I don't think your issue is the camera, but rather your "mindfulness". That's not an equipment issue, but rather something you need to conquer. I would suggest sticking with your current iPhone and get the best you can out of it before spending any money on a replacement. Once you have reached the limits of what you can achieve with your current iPhone, you will be in a much better position to figure out what your camera needs are. Given the fact that printing does not seem at the top of your list, work on the other aspects of photography first....

I agree that there was no issue with the camera, except that the camera *was* the issue. It was just too cumbersome to take with, and sat unused. While I wouldn’t ever claim to be a master of the device, I feel I could use it to a degree of its potential, and it served me well until it didn’t, and I’m ok with that. It’s still a good camera and maybe in several years I’ll desire another DSLR, but for now it’s just not for me.

I do agree the mindfulness is more of a mental block, or hurtle that I need to overcome. I’d say even with a small and pocket sized camera, it won’t be with me 100% or the time, but I feel I’d be much more prone to taking it along.

As for the iPhone, the convenience can’t be beat, but I feel like I’m hitting against the limits of the sensor. Two examples from this weekend: indoor water park, plenty of windows with bright 11am sunshine, loads of indoor lighting as well - can’t get sharp images.

Portrait mode, no crop or digital zoom, no motion - grainy/fuzzy detail around the mouth, eyes and rest of face.


Photo mode, tele lens, no crop or digital zoom no motion - grainy and fuzzy everywhere.


I feel like my phone/camera holding and stance are good, the lighting was good (photo 2 is definitely worse lighting/shadowy) and the photos turned out mediocre at best.

Would the new iPhone, Panasonic or Sony cameras improve this at all?

[Manfred M]

Would the new iPhone, Panasonic or Sony cameras improve this at all?

The reason I moved from a point & shoot and superzoom camera to a DSLR was because they did not do these types of images particularly well. I have not used those types of cameras in quite some time, but motion tracking and low light performance have traditionally been weaker than higher end cameras.

[davidedric]

Low light performance, certainly. I think that has to be a given, with a smaller sensor and modest aperture that will always be so.

Motion tracking, I'm not so sure. The demos I've seen of the RX100 vii have been very impressive, probably benefiting from Sony's af expertise. Still to be tried out in the field, though.

I'm also impressed by the concept and execution of it's stacked sensor, again benefiting from Sony expertise, that eliminates the rolling shutter effect with the electronic shutter.

For me, the biggest challenge will be managing the very small body with limited direct controls

The reason I moved from a point & shoot and superzoom camera to a DSLR was because they did not do these types of images particularly well. I have not used those types of cameras in quite some time, but motion tracking and low light performance have traditionally been weaker than higher end cameras.