D7000 colour space setting

[crisscross]

Hi Peter - I am puzzled - Exif tool (hosted in mac GraphicConverter) says no profile for the 1st one & opRGB for the 2nd and very little exif info on either (1024x768 files)

The one thing that is essential is that to be "sRGB" as the world/web knows it, it has to be the genuine article sRGB IEC 61966-2.1

As I said above, the sRGB in camera setting on the D7000 is Nikon sRGB which is different from the IEC version in Capture NX2 and it is only that and View NX2 that take any notice of what is set in camera as far as I can tell. Have you tried doing 1st stage conversion using View NX2, but not altering anything? I am not familiar with GIMP.

My own conclusion has been to keep to my D80 practice of setting camera to Adobe RGB and converting to IEC RGB immediately before saving a jpg for the web

[Colin Southern]

I'm confused - it's impossible to apply a colour profile to a RAW file; it simply just can't be done. So (with the possible exception of a colourspace metadata tag being fed through to NX2 which can't be over-written), then it can't make any difference what the camera is set to.

[Letrow]

I'm confused - it's impossible to apply a colour profile to a RAW file; it simply just can't be done. So (with the possible exception of a colourspace metadata tag being fed through to NX2 which can't be over-written), then it can't make any difference what the camera is set to.

Ah...but I wasn't comparing RAW files of course. These are JPG files straight from the D7000. I wanted to see whether any difference was visible, so it did not make sense to do that with RAW. I should have explained that better ;-)

Chris: on EXIF data I always look at what Flickr shows me. That may be misleading, but it seems pretty consistent with what I am doing in camera. Flickr shows me the color profile I have used in camera and it does match.

[Colin Southern]

Ah...but I wasn't comparing RAW files of course. These are JPG files straight from the D7000. I wanted to see whether any difference was visible, so it did not make sense to do that with RAW. I should have explained that better ;-)

Hi Peter,

Sorry - I was referring more to the original post. Assuming that one is shooting RAW (as one should be for max quality) then I don't understand why one would be concerned about a camera setting that isn't used.

[crisscross]

I'm confused - it's impossible to apply a colour profile to a RAW file; it simply just can't be done. So (with the possible exception of a colourspace metadata tag being fed through to NX2 which can't be over-written), then it can't make any difference what the camera is set to.

Exactly Colin - I remember you telling me about the tag when I had accidentally set my D80 to SGB setting a year or two back; I subsequently had a dialogue with Nikon technical. Yes it doesn't matter in as much as you can use what colour space you want for PP irrespective of camera setting, but the tag stays.

Working in Adobe RGB for PP, the conversion to IEC RGB for web has to be done after all other changes in NX2 (but that is a side branch and again does not affect RAW/NEF file)

Peter - I couldn't find these files on your Flickr site

Greetings Colin!!!

[Letrow]

Peter - I couldn't find these files on your Flickr site

Sorry Chris, I assumed you could see the EXIF. It is in my photostream but not on Peet's Photographs (because it is uninteresting apart for the sRGB/Adobe thing). Below is one of the EXIF data sheets and I indicated with a where the color space data is (couldn't find a way to change the Font colour). Right behind it is what the other EXIF data said. The rest of the data is exactly the same.

Dates

Taken on	February 4, 2012 at 1.44pm CET (edit)
Posted to Flickr	February 4, 2012 at 7.23PM CET (edit)

Exif data

Camera	Nikon D7000
Exposure	0.004 sec (1/250)
Aperture	f/13.0
Focal Length	200 mm
Focal Length	201.6 mm
ISO Speed	220
Exposure Bias	0 EV
Flash	Off, Did not fire
X-Resolution	72 dpi
Y-Resolution	72 dpi
Orientation	Horizontal (normal)
Software	GIMP 2.6.11
Date and Time (Modified)	2012:02:04 19:21:23
Artist	peterwortel@hotmail.com
YCbCr Positioning	Co-sited
Copyright	Peter Wortel
XPKeywords	adobe
Exposure Program	Manual
Date and Time (Original)	2012:02:04 13:44:53
Date and Time (Digitized)	2012:02:04 13:44:53
Compressed Bits Per Pixel	4
Max Aperture Value	5.7
Metering Mode	Multi-segment
Light Source	Unknown
Sub Sec Time	70
Sub Sec Time Original	70
Sub Sec Time Digitized	70
Color Space	sRGB
Sensing Method	One-chip color area
CFAPattern	[Red,Green][Green,Blue]
Custom Rendered	Normal
Exposure Mode	Manual
White Balance	Auto
Digital Zoom Ratio	1
Scene Capture Type	Standard
Gain Control	None
Contrast	Normal
Saturation	Normal
Sharpness	Hard
Subject Distance Range	Unknown
Maker Note Version	2.10
ISO	220
Quality	Fine
White Balance	Auto1
Focus Mode	AF-S
Flash Setting	Normal
White Balance Fine Tune	0 0
WB_ RBLevels	2.015625 1.41015625 1 1
Program Shift	0
Exposure Difference	+0.1
Flash Exposure Comp	0
ISOSetting	3200
Image Boundary	0 0 3696 2448
Flash Exposure Bracket Value	0.0
Exposure Bracket Value	0
Crop Hi Speed	Off (4992x3280 cropped to 4992x3280 at pixel 0,0)
Exposure Tuning	0
Serial Number	6058319
Color Space	sRGB the other EXIF sheet shows Adobe RGB
VRInfo Version	0100
Vibration Reduction	On
Active D- Lighting	Auto
Picture Control Version	0100
Picture Control Name	Standard-PWv6
Picture Control Base	Standard
Picture Control Adjust	Default Settings
Picture Control Quick Adjust	n/a
Sharpness	6
Contrast	Normal
Brightness	Normal
Saturation	Normal
Hue Adjustment	None
Filter Effect	n/a
Toning Effect	n/a
Toning Saturation	n/a
Timezone	+01:00
Daylight Savings	Yes
Date Display Format	D/M/Y
ISOExpansion	Off
ISO2	3200
ISOExpansion2	Off
Auto Distortion Control	On
Lens Type	G VR
Lens	18-200mm f/3.5-5.6
Flash Mode	Did Not Fire
Shooting Mode	Single-Frame, Auto ISO
Lens FStops	5.33
Shot Info Version	0220
Firmware Version	1.03
Noise Reduction	Off
WB_ RGGBLevels	516 361 256 200
Lens Data Version	0204
Exit Pupil Position	113.8 mm
AFAperture	5.8
Focus Position	0xff
Focus Distance	21.13 m
Lens IDNumber	139
Min Focal Length	18.3 mm
Max Focal Length	201.6 mm
Max Aperture At Min Focal	3.6
Max Aperture At Max Focal	5.7
MCUVersion	253
Effective Max Aperture	5.7
Retouch History	None
Image Data Size	4222273
Shutter Count	8730
Flash Info Version	0104
Multi Exposure Version	0100
Multi Exposure Mode	Off
Multi Exposure Shots	0
Multi Exposure Auto Gain	Off
High ISONoise Reduction	Off
Power Up Time	2012:02:04 13:43:12
AFInfo2 Version	0100
Contrast Detect AF	Off
AFArea Mode	Single Area
Phase Detect AF	Unknown (3)
Primary AFPoint	Center
AFPoints Used	Unknown (01 00 00 00 00 00 00)
Contrast Detect AFIn Focus	No
File Info Version	0100
Directory Number	109
File Number	8648
AFFine Tune	Off
AFFine Tune Index	n/a
AFFine Tune Adj	0
Compression	JPEG (old-style)
Subject
Date Acquired	2012:02:04 13:43:54.146

Hope that is helpful.

[crisscross]

Will have look sometime Peter - just come back from Suffolk with hundreds of birdie pics

[crisscross]

I'm confused - it's impossible to apply a colour profile to a RAW file; it simply just can't be done. So (with the possible exception of a colourspace metadata tag being fed through to NX2 which can't be over-written), then it can't make any difference what the camera is set to.

Afterthought - I think we should get into the habit of calling Nikon files NEF=Nikon Electronic Format, not RAW. Wheareas admittedly most software totally ignores 1/3 of the NEF data and uses only the generic(?) RAW data; the additional info from camera settings saves one heck of a lot of time for users of Capture NX2 where it remains available.

[Colin Southern]

Afterthought - I think we should get into the habit of calling Nikon files NEF=Nikon Electronic Format, not RAW.

NEF is a type of RAW file, as is CR2, DNG etc.

Wheareas admittedly most software totally ignores 1/3 of the NEF data and uses only the generic(?) RAW data; the additional info from camera settings saves one heck of a lot of time for users of Capture NX2 where it remains available.

Um, not sure where you got that from - with the exception of most metadata tags (which are only a few bytes long), I'm not aware of ANY data being ignored by converters like ACR. In terms of the honouring / not honouring metadata tags etc, I prefer to start with a clean sheet (not have them honoured) - otherwise if they were honoured - and incorrectly set - then that could be a big problem ... IMO it's easier to just apply a given preset once into ACR.

[crisscross]

NEF is a type of RAW file, as is CR2, DNG etc.

Um, not sure where you got that from

While considering the upgrade from D80 to D7000, I took a more serious interest in Nikon "Picture Control". Whereas it can just be turned off, I think that intelligent settings of one's preferred degree of sharpness, contrast saturation etc can save time later OR be reviewed from scratch; it was the same with the earlier "Non-picture control", but less powerful and PC can be customised on computer and fed back into the camera if one was doing an "event shoot".

There was a similar thing with CR2 on my 350D, which only showed up in DPP and to a slight extent in DxO. There is a 'linear' option that can do a remarkable restoration of blown highlights.

Those sort of features just don't show in ACR (nor aperture etc). To be more controversial still, I think it is wrong to think of RAW as 'unadulterated' info, as all kinds of algorithms have been used to convert the truly raw data to a usable image (as summarised in the forum tutorials) & backtracking one step on those is to my mind no different to PP forward from RAW.

I know you won't agree Colin, but I think we should be careful to let others make up their own minds on such things where matters are not really black and white.

The last straw with ACR was adobe not producing a D7000 module for CS4. I really loathe software houses forcing us into expensive upgrades. I use CS4 about once a month on average & it already has 5 billion features, maybe the bees knees for the marketing industry, but superfluous to photography

[Colin Southern]

The last straw with ACR was adobe not producing a D7000 module for CS4. I really loathe software houses forcing us into expensive upgrades.

I'm afraid that that's not and has never been the case Chris; they're trying to run a profitable business, and it's just not a smart business decision to allocate human resource to updating an obsolete product when the end user can simply use their free DNG converter (or have Bridge do it automatically as part of the file transfer/renaming process) to convert files from later model cameras into the standardised (and open) DNG format (which is still a RAW file format), which then allows the file to be opened in ANY version of CS*

So no reason to cough up hard earned dollars just to process D7000 photos in CS5 - as DNGs, you can open them in CS4, CS3, CS2, or CS

* subject to the DNG schema version selected at time of conversion.