Best choice for newbe?

[Ariadnne]

I have promised to buy a new camera for my young grandson, he has some knowledge on the theory of Photography, developing and printing of the old type-- and has a digital point & shoot. He is interested in nature and close ups. So plants/ animals/rocks, nearby.

I have an old SLR fitted with a Tameron 70-210mm (F/3.8-4 lens) which he has used on some occasions with success. What he likes is being able to 'loose' the back ground, by using a high speed/auto apperture mode.

I cannot afford to buy him a digital SLR, which would be the answer, but is there any camera that might suit- having say a F2.00 lens,

Or are there any other options?

Thank you

[Quinn]

Hi Ariadnne
I know its a personal question, but if you could give us an indication of price point, I think you may get a few suggestions. For my own suggestion, I wouldn't dismiss investigating a second hand DSLR, The slightly older Canon's are good value on ebay now. I started with a second hand 20D with a prime 50mm f1.8 lens. Cant remember what I paid, but it wouldn't have been a huge amount because I dont have a Huge amount :-).
Hope that helps!
Phil

[Ariadnne]

Hi Ariadnne
I know its a personal question, but if you could give us an indication of price point, I think you may get a few suggestions. For my own suggestion, I wouldn't dismiss investigating a second hand DSLR, The slightly older Canon's are good value on ebay now. I started with a second hand 20D with a prime 50mm f1.8 lens. Cant remember what I paid, but it wouldn't have been a huge amount because I dont have a Huge amount :-).
Hope that helps!
Phil

[Ariadnne]

hello Phil,

I would like to pay about 200 up to 250 if pushed, for new. I hadnt considered used because I still dont know what I should look for!
On older DSLR there is the problem of formatted cards and batteries, I understand, and also I suspect they are quite large and heavy--as my old manual SLR is.
Maybe the combination I am looking for dosnt exist!, I had thought about those avertized as 'Bridge' cameras, but didnt know what the lens and apertures were like on those.
I even looked for a lower sized say 10mp, but they dont seem to be avaiable now. I dont know what the computer capacity for storage he has.


Thank you for replying, if you can think of anything we could look at please say...

[JPS]

I have promised to buy a new camera for my young grandson, he has some knowledge on the theory of Photography, developing and printing of the old type-- and has a digital point & shoot. He is interested in nature and close ups. So plants/ animals/rocks, nearby.

I have an old SLR fitted with a Tameron 70-210mm (F/3.8-4 lens) which he has used on some occasions with success. What he likes is being able to 'loose' the back ground, by using a high speed/auto apperture mode.

I cannot afford to buy him a digital SLR, which would be the answer, but is there any camera that might suit- having say a F2.00 lens,

Or are there any other options?

Thank you

My 1st camera was a Fujifilm, fantastic unit and even though I now have a DSR I will not get rid of my Fujifilm. This is selling for around £165 at present, might be worth considering, good zoom & Macro looks to cover all your looking for.
Hope this helps.

Fujifilm FinePix S4500 Digital Bridge Camera


With its huge 30x zoom lens, ergonomic design and an electronic viewfinder, 14MP resolution, HD movies and fast startup, the FinePix S4500 Bridge Camera offers a great deal for the creatively minded shooter.

Extra Long Fujinon Zoom
The 30x Fujinon zoom lens in the S4500 features Optical Power Zoom with 45-step zoom control, giving you fine control over your perspective. The equivalent focal length range of 24-720mm means that both extra wide and super telephoto are included. Also, for nature lovers and collectors the 2cm Super Macro mode offers highly detailed close-up images.

Electronic Viewfinder
Within the FinePix sits a 200,000-dot electronic viewfinder , or EVF. This is especially useful in fast moving action and bright sunlight. For a larger, regular view there is also a 230,000-dot LCD monitor that measures 3 inches across. Compared with previous FinePix models it has improved brightness and more intuitive camera navigation.

Detailed High Speed Image Sensor
The 14 megapixel CCD sensor on this camera offers super sharp image quality and the ISO sensitivity can be extended to a range of ISO 64-6400, ideal for dim lighting conditions. To further reduce the risk of camera shake, Fujifilm have included CCD-Shift Image Stabilisation.

Fast Reactions
Seize the moment thanks to improved startup, AF speed and camera response time so that you don’t have to hang around and miss the shot while the camera is still getting ready to take the picture.

[bhurley]

While most of these may be out of your price range, here's a good roundup of current "premium compact" cameras on the market, which includes comparisons of sensor size and widest aperture size, as well as a price comparison (note that prices are in US dollars):

http://www.techhive.com/article/2000...ct-camera.html

[William W]

What's a Canon EOS 1100D and 18 to 55 kit lens cost in the UK?

For a beginning in dSLR Photography that kit would last a long time and have both growth (of the kit) and learning (for the child) potential.

WW

[Ariadnne]

The model you noted seems to retail at about £350.00 -depending on colour and supplier . I had thought of trying to find something similar in the older 10mp range, since we shall only use A5 prints. What do you think ?

[Ady]

Hi Ariadnne,

A used 450D with kit lens from Ebay can be had for less than £300, such as this one.

My partner is still using a 350D, it is old and tired, has a lowly 8MP sensor, doesn't have the latest in fancy AF, or high ISO, or weather sealing, or a high frames per second, or... I could go on but to be fair to it the images captured can be as good as any entry level DSLR and it is quite capable of producing a perfectly decent 8"x12" print. The 350D can be found for less than £200 with kit lens and accessories.

However, the 450D is a significant leap forward in technology, build quality and image quality so if you can stretch that far it would be well worth it. Take a look at these reviews:

The Digital Picture - 350D Review
The Digital Picture - 450D Review

Hope this helps, cheers,
Ady

[DanK]

I used a 10 MP Rebel 400 (XTi) when I first switched to digital, and it was more than adequate for starting out. All of the later Rebels would be an improvement, and the kit lens that came with all of the later ones is far better. (If the 18-55 does not have image stabilization, it's the old one, which I would avoid if you have a choice.) The controls of the inexpensive cameras are not as easy to use, and there are other limitations as well, but the sensors are fine, and they are capable of producing superb images. All of the techniques you need to learn can be learned with a camera like this.

Taken with a Rebel 400, with a Canon EF-S 60mm macro lens:

[Ariadnne]

Dear All---

Thank you for advice and the photo- it has a the WOW factor, and I am sure that is the sort of image he would be looking forward to making. He has some of fossils, which are great (taken on my old SLR), but of course they are static !

Will have a look at the suggestions made, thank you all for the advice. I wondered secondly if the old lenses I have from the manual SLR would be useable on the digital SLRS ? or are they a totally different configuration and fitting?

[Manfred M]

I wondered secondly if the old lenses I have from the manual SLR would be useable on the digital SLRS ? or are they a totally different configuration and fitting?

That depends on the manufacturer of the SLR; Canon changed the lens mounts when they introduced the EF mount in 1987. The FD mount lenses will not work. The situation with Nikon is somewhat better as the F mount has been in use since 1959. That being said there have been changes to some of the mechanical elements over the years, so caution is needed in answering the question too.

The other issue is actually being able to use manual focus. In my opinion, the camera manufacturers have designed the focusing screens for autofocus use and have dropped some of the features that helped get a sharp focus with these lenses. With Nikon, a lens without the CPU contacts may be a bit problematic when it comes to getting the metering to work on the lower end bodies you are looking at.

The other issue I would caution you on regarding the both point & shoot and crossover cameras in the price range you are looking at. The lenses tend to be a bit slower, (these are much less expensive to manufacture), so the narrow depth of field your grandson is working with on your old film SLR will not be available. Being able to select shutter speed, aperture and ISO may also be limited or non-existant on these cameras.

[Ariadnne]

That is an interesting point I had not thought about. -Depth of field showing. On my point & shoot is a portrait option. I can get a good picture - snap format!
I took a picture this afternoon of a tiger -lilly at a distance of about 20mm (9ins), which is good, sharp and good colour, but even when I move 2 and 4 feet and 6 feet away -everything is in still focus, the centre point- the flower is just smaller in the srceen.

So what I would ask is, on a digital bridge camera, would an f2 setting at a high speed (1/1000) not provide the shallow depth of field that we both like?
In which case I suppose I have to look at a DSLR, perhaps an older second hand- and would the lens have to be any particular
specification?

I must thank you all for the information you have provided, I had forgotton how interesting it all is.

[Manfred M]

So what I would ask is, on a digital bridge camera, would an f2 setting at a high speed (1/1000) not provide the shallow depth of field that we both like?

My point was that I have not seen any bridge cameras with an f/2 lens. Even the expensive top-of-the-line pro zoom lenses are f/2.8 and are around 10 times your budget. The low f-stop number, not the high shutter speed give you the shallow depth of field.

[bhurley]

My point was that I have not seen any bridge cameras with an f/2 lens.

Depending on how you define "bridge" cameras, though, there are a few (these are all high-end compacts):

F1.4 Panasonic Lumix LX7 and Samsung EX2F
F1.8 Nikon Coolpix P310 and Sony Cyber-shot RX100
F2.0 Canon PowerShot S100 and Fujifilm X10

Note though that if you zoom these out the max aperture size decreases.

[William W]

The model you noted seems to retail at about £350.00 -depending on colour and supplier. I had thought of trying to find something similar in the older 10mp range, since we shall only use A5 prints. What do you think ?

OK that’s above your budget, I understand.

Mega pixels are not the main concern: 10mp 8mp 12mp – all the same essentially for the purposes you outline – I would be looking at the High ISO capacity.

As already mentioned in the Canon range the EOS 450D was a major step forward, although in one of our kits we still use a 400D and it is a very capable tool.

***

That is an interesting point I had not thought about. -Depth of field showing. On my point & shoot is a portrait option. I can get a good picture - snap format!
. . . So what I would ask is, on a digital bridge camera, would an f2 setting at a high speed (1/1000) not provide the shallow depth of field that we both like?
In which case I suppose I have to look at a DSLR, perhaps an older second hand- and would the lens have to be any particular specification?

The achievable DoF is also related to the camera’s FORMAT: not ONLY to the lens’s Maximum Aperture.

Intrinsically a smaller format has LESS shallow Depth of Field capacity.

Without going into the mathematics – and just roughly speaking – an F/2~2.8 lens on a typical ‘P&S camera’, has the equivalence of about an F/4.5 lens on a 450D in regard to Shallow Depth of Field capacity – so in this regard that is one reason why I suggested a DSLR and the kit lens as an economically viable starting point.

The Kit lens can be used to make Shallow Depth of Field Images – such as Portraits.

For Flowers (close up work) a modest investment in a set of extension tubes will open a new vista of Photography to explore.

WW

[jcuknz]

A 'cheap' set of extension tubes is likely to be a can of worms with modern camera lenses simply becuase they are designed to be controlled by the camera and the tubes cut off the connections. Far better is the Close-up lens which fits on the front of the lens and everything works as before in a slightly modified as far as focus form.

A good investment for him would be a better type of editing programme where one can put background or forground content out of focus to emphasise the subject matter. It doesn't have to be done by the 'fast lens' There is also the point that done in camera 'that's it' whereas things done in editing can be controlled to the required degree.

A favoured technique of the bridge camera fraternity is to use a moderate CUI lens to overcome the inability of their lens to focus close when at full zoom and one doesn't going in close but stands back somewhat and use the narrow angle of the long zoom to get the 'tight framing'

This is the whole frame with the camera about ten inches from the subject, A cicada disturbed from hibernation.
It was taken with my old Nikon 5700 but in your price range there are Panasonic FZ30 or FZ50 which would do just as well second hand in good condition on Amazon They use SD or SDHC cards.
I normally use a moderate CU lens, a two dioptre or 500mm, as the more powerful CU lens leads to lower image quality.

When digital arrived and I got my 5700, which cost the earth then, I found I had a very versatile camera considerably better than my SLR and bag of lenses and coupled with a good editing programme I started to produce good photographs. You get much more bang for your buck with a bridge camera, preferably Panasonic in my experience.

[William W]

If it wasn’t clear (and I think it was abundantly clear) –

“For Flowers (close up work) a modest investment in a set of extension tubes will open a new vista of Photography to explore.”

Does NOT mention “cheap” nor imply that connotation.

Opinions will vary as to what tools make best companion for a 18 to 55 Kit Lens to explore macro and Close Up work - for a youth with a passion to learn about Photography.



WW

[artsygirl]

I'm very happy with my Canon HV30. I rate the picture quality, color quality, low-light ability, white balance all excellent. The zoom control is a little close for my fingers and I found myself holding the camera less firmly (ie with the tips of my fingers rather than my whole hand) which would be wearisome on a long shoot, but tripods are still the best way to shoot video for steady pictures. On the other hand the anti-vibration correction seems to help a lot.

[keith201]

Sorry mate but that's not a cicada, it's a weta!