learning the "triangle"

[captivating]

I think "no mo' grams" works for me, LOL!!

Does anyone in Engineering remember nomograms? I was looking at this image and thinking "if only the swing pivot could be moved up and down" and, lo!, a faded memory of nomograms appeared. If instead of a swing a vertical line was drawn in the middle and scaled in EV then you get a chart by which, with the use of ruler, you can do all sort of things. Imagine pivoting the ruler on f/4 and finding the EV for a given speed; or placing the ruler on a speed and an aperture and reading the EV in the middle; or placing the ruler on a speed and an EV and finding the resulting aperture.

In the 21st century, it would of course be an app on your smart phone or tablet - probably already done, or one of us could make a name for themself!

[xpatUSA]

I think "no mo' grams" works for me, LOL!!

Sorry to hear that. Perhaps one of these then?



From http://www.brayebrookobservatory.org...CALC_HIST.html

I had actually found a modern example which calculated between height, body mass index (BMI) and weight and then lost the stupid link while looking for more "no mo's". Oh, well . . .

[Graystar]

From http://www.brayebrookobservatory.org...CALC_HIST.html

I love those old exposure calculators.

This one is just incredible...



Read about it here... http://www.petapixel.com/2011/11/14/...rom-the-1920s/

Here's one that can be printed out, cut up, and assembled into a simple but effective exposure calculator.
http://www.squit.co.uk/photo/exposurecalc.html

[xpatUSA]

Love that French mechanical one! Worthy of Babbage himself . .

I was going to put this one up but it was a bit hard to read . . . and pretty hard to understand



It came from here: http://www.pynomo.org/wiki/index.php...raphy_exposure

.

[Donald]

I hope you realise that Denise will now be a gibbering wreck, shaking uncontrollably in a darkened room in deepest Oregon, with a wet towel over her head wailing, "I'm sorry, I'll never take another photograph. Promise."

[Graystar]

I was going to put this one up but it was a bit hard to read . . . and pretty hard to understand

It came from here: http://www.pynomo.org/wiki/index.php...raphy_exposure

That's just awesome! I'm so glad my camera has a meter!

I also really like that last one because it's very much like my process. With that calculator you first figure out the light, and then, with ISO, a point is marked on R1. With that mark, your exposure is figured out. Now all that's needed is to use the point at R1 to pick an aperture and shutter.

That's how I set exposure on my Nikon D90. Whenever I step into new light I just pull out the gray card from my back pocket, set a custom white balance, and if the light is constant I'll just press my AE-L button and lock exposure. That's it...exposure is set and I didn't even touch aperture, shutter or ISO (technical note...I do have to set +1.3 EC because of the brightness of my card...but my EC is nearly always set to that anyways, so it's rarely an extra step.)

My AE Lock will lock in the light level, just like that calculator locks in the light level at R1. Now I'm free to pick any aperture/shutter combination that matches my exposure (and I can change ISO if necessary.) With my process I've separated the setting of exposure from the setting of effects (DOF and blur.) I think of exposure in terms of EV...not as a combination of aperture, shutter, and ISO.

This is why I dislike the exposure triangle. The CiC page titled "Camera Exposure" has practically nothing on exposure. It's all about the effects of the settings. So it has mixed the idea of the effects of the these settings with the setting of exposure, which I feel is confusing to beginners. I think it's much better to tell beginners that the lighting conditions sets the exposure, and that a given exposure limits the range of aperture/shutter combinations that you can work with to get the effects you desire. Furthermore, you can tell a beginner that, if necessary, the exposure can be fudged by changing ISO or adding ND filters in order to provide a more suitable range of aperture/shutter combinations to get the effect you want.

BTW the CiC page also says, "Furthermore, just as the rate of rainfall was beyond your control above, so too is natural light for a photographer." But this is not true because ND filters can be used to control the light, and in fact, ISO is a control of light. And this is the crux of the problem with the Exposure Triangle...it leaves out light, which is just as controllable as the other three parameters (maybe not as easily, but certainly as controllable) and misrepresents ISO.

This is also why I like P mode for beginners. First, the beginner is properly taught how to set exposure (lock in a gray card, evaluate tone, Sunny 16, chimp a few histograms...whatever.) Then use Program Shift to select a different aperture/shutter combination than what the camera suggested to get the desired effect. Can't find a suitable combination? Change the ISO (and understand the consequences) or maybe add some ND filters. I think that process builds a far greater understanding of the relationships involved than an exposure triangle that doesn't even demonstate exposure at all.

(Hmmm...am I ranting again?)

[wlou]

Hello Denise, I am glad you found this helpfull. Dont thay say we are all related at the 6th level?
You will find all kinds of great information on this site like I did. I regularly go back to the tutorials and re-check information. Funny thing, after a while it starts to make sence.

[captivating]

Hi Louise I am counting on that last line of yours here, LOL!! Oh boy will that be a glorious day!! denise

Hello Denise, I am glad you found this helpfull. Dont thay say we are all related at the 6th level?
You will find all kinds of great information on this site like I did. I regularly go back to the tutorials and re-check information. Funny thing, after a while it starts to make sence.

[wlou]

I have received a lot of good advice. Number one: carry your camera book with you and read it. It may be a boring read so "my advice": choose one item in the book, may it be a button or a fonction, find it on your camera and go take picture using that item. When it is easy to find or use, change page and find something new. One little project at a time. Yep, baby steps, and it works! Oh and take pictures of people or thing you like, the reasults are usually more pleasing.
On the other hand, as a practice photo shoot, littles items around the house are fun and easy and do not complain when the flash hits them right in the eyes.

[rawill]

Denise

As you can see, what seems like a simple question can often set lots of hares running. In photography forum terms, that means people take your question as a launch point to explore and debate the subject in great detail.

What you need to hold onto is the question you asked and from all the excellent dialogue that's taken place above, just extract what you need in terms of helping you at your present stage of learning and development. It's very easy to be put off and feel overwhelmed by the sense that you'll never understand all of this stuff, so why try and why not just give up.

Don't. You don't necessarily need to know all of this stuff in the same intimate detail as folks above, in order to make great pictures. So, take it at your pace and enjoy it.

Excellent comment.

Starting out new in any subject/hobby/venture needs a basic foundational knowledge.
It can take a while to get it to "sink in", so my advice, is to read and practise, in my view, reading woith out practice does not really work well. Well it doesn't for me, and just practicing without reading can mean a slower learning journey.


So just stick with it. Don't be overwhelmed, and as said, pick out what you can understand and apply it.

It will be/should be fun.

[rawill]

I regularly go back to the tutorials and re-check information. Funny thing, after a while it starts to make sence.

Exactly, this is learning and is as it should be, unless of course you are one of the few who have a photographic mind!~!
But then you wouldn't be taking photos.

[DollyP]

Just my tuppence. Keep things very simple to start with. Learn how your camera operates in it's auto mode and concentrate on adjusting the exposure so that you get a feel for how the camera determines exposure in use. Then step up to Program mode, learn that and then up to A,S and M. There's many of us leave our cameras on P most of the time, and our photos are non the worse for it.
David

[bisso7]

Can you recommend a good read for me on Exposure Value? If I could I would take a photography class but I am tied up with other classes. I can read though or watch a tutorial.

Hello Denise:

I'm still, very much, a beginner, but I found Bryan Peterson's book called "Understanding Exposure" to be of great value to me as a beginning photographer. He also has several videos on YouTube that I found helpful.

Also, Tony Northrup's book "Stunning Digital Photography" I also found a very helpful resource. Both book I find myself referring back to when in doubt.

1. http://www.amazon.com/Understanding-...nding+exposure

2. http://www.amazon.com/Tony-Northrups...al+photography

Warm regards,

Jeff : )