Processing Images

[TommyGuido]

OK, first off, using a Canon S100 point and shoot mostly for dive photos. Shooting RAW +JPEG is not a problem.

The problem, I am not very familiar with post processing of images other than the occasion crop and resize. When I used windows Irfanview was sufficient with my needs.

I am using a MacBook Pro OSX and really want to get better acclimated to more in-depth refinements of my dive images.

Recently, I have been processing some photos from a dive trip and uploading to an online personal gallery I have on a shared hosting server. The three options for software apps I have are Preview, ACDSeePro, and Adobe Photoshop Elements. Mainly, I have only been making corrections to the JPEG version of the shots for uploading, they are pretty much only to share with family and friends.

The first question is about the Preview app. Other than it having only the most basic editing features, is there any reason NOT to use this app?

It is fairly simple, and I think it has helped me as far a getting the feel for making different adjustments.

Adobe Photoshop Elements: I hear a lot of good things and it seems to be the choice of many for digital manipulation of images. It seems like it has all the bells and whistles anyone could ever need. With that being said, I get kind of overwhelmed with all the choices I have to make with and it seems to make the learning curve very difficult for me. I dont it to be difficult, I think this should be something fun. I guess what I am trying to say that it isnt very user friendly for me.

ACDSee Pro: seems a bit more user friendly for me, I dont know if it has all the bells and whistles like Adobe P/E, but not sure if I need all that. It has more editing features than Preview and seems like it would be my next step for image processing. One thing with this app, it seems to suck the ram memory life out of my MBP with extended use. I dont know the proper term, but I think it slowly latches on to more of my ram until the computer just bogs down. I use a third party app to try and release some ram, but if I get too involved and forget, I have issues of locking up and have to 'force quit' in order to kill things. I believe that with 8gb ram, I am maxed out.

Any comments, concerns or suggestions appreciated.

[arslanturegun]

ACDSee is one of the most user friendly software I have used. I actually have used it since Win 95 .
It is of course not like Photoshop but for developing a RAW file it is quite similar to ACR or LR.
For preview I think it is the best.
For editing instead (I love editing rather than taking photos) I prefer photoshop or something similar which lets me use layers, masks and etc.
About your problem...
I don't know anything about MAC and its OS. I am using ACDSee on a PC (2 core 3 Ghz and 6 Gb of RAM) without any problems.
Cheers,
Arslan

[Geoff F]

There are many options for software which can easily do basic editing. The differences become more apparent when you want to use things like layers and masks, etc.

That is where programmes like Elements, or even more complex and expensive alternatives, really show their worth.

But there are a few low cost, even free, options instead of Adobe software. Gimp for instance.

Elements can be tricky to learn. Possibly, initially more difficult than some similar software, except Gimp. But the advantage with Elements is that it is universally used so can be simpler to ask for advice.

[Alandb]

It would help if you were clearer on what you want to accomplish. Will you ever print these photos? Are you just doing minor touchups? Do want to do more complex post-processing in the future. If it is just minor touchups, stay with Preview. If you want to enhance your skill set, learn Elements. I used ACDSee a long time ago. It has a much better file management interface than Elements. Try Elements to get an idea of what you can really do in post-processing. It is an industry standard software with lots of websites, books and DVDs to help you learn.

[Downrigger]

I am pretty much a newcomer to post-processing, and started up with Lightroom about eight weeks ago. My comments are without the perspective of having used anything else (but iPhoto tools) Using the tutorials from the Adobe site and fooling around on my own I have been very happy with Lightroom - I can now do a lot with it, and have the clear sense that there is a terrific amount of room for me to grow further. I think this is an impressively intuitive, crisp software with a wide range of capabilities. The real challenge is not to overapply its tools and tweaks and to find the path to less is more.

You can download for a free 30 day trial, and I suspect a lot of folks starting out with pp would have a similar (positive) experience to mine. I was happy to spring for the $150 to buy it for keeps after my month was up. You apparently can grow into a workflow that extents into Photoshop/CS but I am having trouble imagining what I would want to do beyond what Lightroom affords me at this point.

[TommyGuido]

It would help if you were clearer on what you want to accomplish. Will you ever print these photos?

Probably not.

Do want to do more complex post-processing in the future.

Yes. Most of the picture i want to tweak up a bit are dive photos, and from what I understand, no matter how hard you try to get it right when taking the shot, computer processing is inevitable.

If it is just minor touchups, stay with Preview.

Preview is OK but the funny thing is, that the most used tools in Preview, I cant place on the toolbar and they do not have shortcut commands either.

If you want to enhance your skill set, learn Elements. I used ACDSee a long time ago. It has a much better file management interface than Elements.

Would ACDSee Pro be a good stepping stone before graduating to Adobe Photoshop Elements? PSElements just seems like it has too many things on the dinner plate for me and may be something in the long run after I get a better feel of how to edit my photos.

[Alandb]

Yes, post-processing is inevitable. Think of it as a darkroom. I don't know enough about ACDSee to advise. Elements has a lot of books and videos to help you (Dummies). It will teach you about layers that ACDSee might not. Look on Youtube.

[davidedric]

I do have ACDSee and I agree with Arslan that it is an excellent previewer. I also have Photoshop Elements and Lightroom 4.

However, if I were starting over I would choose Lightroom without hesitation (both for pp and organising). It has a very accessible user interface for straightforward adjustments, with a lot of depth as you progress. Try the free demo.

Dave

[HenkB]

I am using a MacBook Pro OSX and really want to get better acclimated to more in-depth refinements of my dive images.

... Mainly, I have only been making corrections to the JPEG version of the shots for uploading, they are pretty much only to share with family and friends.

Preview is certainly limited enough but, if it serves your needs, why not use it. But then, why not use iPhoto? It is a native Mac app and builds greatly on the Preview interface you already have some familiarity with. Once you have mastered iPhoto then you can move on if you still have some unmet need. The two candidates that best continue the approach you would have learned would be Aperture and Lightroom. I would second the suggestion you investigate Lightroom. It is a very complete photo editor but, unlike PSE, it is expressly designed to be used intuitively, a quality at which Adobe has largely succeeded.

[TommyGuido]

I dont like the way iPhoto wants to take charge of all my photos and moves them around to where IT wants to put them. I did not think there were any way around iPhoto taking charge of managing the file locations.



Preview is limited, but at least it does not want to take control of storing my photos. One of the things in preview, with the adjust colors tool, there is an 'auto color adjust' button that I do use to gauge on which direction I need to go with obtaining a better quality photo. does lightroom or PSE have some sort of auto fix button?

[xpatUSA]

Preview is limited, but at least it does not want to take control of storing my photos. One of the things in preview, with the adjust colors tool, there is an 'auto color adjust' button that I do use to gauge on which direction I need to go with obtaining a better quality photo. does lightroom or PSE have some sort of auto fix button?

In my old version 6 of PSE, the "enhance" menu has two vertical sections - one above for auto fixing this, or that, - or indeed everything in one shot; and one below for doing it all yourself with sliders and stuff. I can not imagine later version doing less. Try not to activate PSE's "Organizer" - it is almost as intrusive as what you wrote about iPhoto!

[HenkB]

I dont like the way iPhoto wants to take charge of all my photos and moves them around to where IT wants to put them. I did not think there were any way around iPhoto taking charge of managing the file locations.

I certainly understand your concern. Feeling in control can be huge. Back somewhere around PS CS (-2) I used iPhoto for about 18 months and learned to live with its file structure. My wife still uses it quite happily and her files stretch back nearly ten years. While using it, I found it not too difficult to find images based on chronology rather than folder names.

But I went back to Photoshop and Bridge (essentially PSE on steroids, without the 'benefit' of any program-provided organization) until a friend, who had started using the Beta version, convinced me to start using Lightroom. What I discovered about LR is that you can choose to manage the file structure as you are probably doing at present or allow Lightroom to manage it a la iPhoto - or somewhere in between. I now specify which super-folders to place photos but allow Lightroom to create sub-folders named for dates. There are other options here, as well.

My file structure, for example, can easily be seen to be neatly divided between Before LR (with a short iPhoto Age) and After LR. At the end of the era BLR, I was experiencing mounting difficulty coming up with comprehensible folder names, both super- and sub-. What makes such finder-level mess a non-issue is the power of keywords. When I initially set up Lightroom I spent a very pleasant bad-weather weekend applying keywords to all my files (at that point ~20k images). By being scrupulous about applying keywords at import, I can now (with at least double the amount) find an image in very short order, usually under a minute. In case you're wondering, Lightroom is a right fine photo editor, too, with a feature set that should cover all the bases for anyone engaged solely in taking reality-based record shots.

[Alandb]

HenkB, I highly concur about Lightroom. My hesitation to recommend for the OP is that it might be too much for him to deal with as he thinks that PSE is very complex. LR may be more than he needs but I highly concur that once you accept its database system and give up thinking in folders, it is terrific. I also use the NIK suite as it is simpler than learning layers in Photoshop and Elements.

[PBelarge]

Sounds like he wants to keep it simple, which he has received good advice.
Once he gets the hang of it he may decide to process more, I know that is what happened with me.

[HenkB]

My hesitation to recommend for the OP is that it might be too much for him to deal with as he thinks that PSE is very complex. LR may be more than he needs

I think Tom shows perfect sense. Anything that reeks of Photoshop and its unintuitive menu structure IS very complex. That said, even though it was a bit of a slog to get to this point, I do appreciate having acquired the ability to deal with layers comfortably.

I took my cue from the tone of the rest of Tom's post. The balance of my message, which I failed to get across, is that either the Quick Develop panel in the Library module or the Basic panel in the Develop module would be equivalent to the tools available in Preview. Even if the database and either of those two panels were all Tom ever used, he'd still be way ahead from using just Preview. And he would already have the rest of Lightroom to grow into at his own pace as his comfort level grew. Lightroom certainly is more than what Tom currently thinks he needs, but personal growth has a way of changing such perceptions.

I have two major hints for anyone contemplating Lightroom. First, it's absolutely OK to play even the most outrageous games. It's all nondestructive and can be undone with one mouse click, today or in a year. Second, eliminate the word "Save" from your vocabulary. Your edits only exist in Lightroom (and ACR) and the only way to resize and get them out is to Export (which is quite easy but, nicely enough, leaves the original quite safe and unchanged).

[TommyGuido]

Last week while playing around with Elements, decided to try a raw image. All the raw images I was trying to open were only appearing like a TV station in the middle of the night after going off the air. No reason why it wouldnt open. I had to go talk to my friend Mister Google and I found out I needed a newer plug in to read the CR2 files. I would have thought that it would have at least give me some sort of error instead of having to track down the error myself.

A day or so ago, I had found that I had already gotten Lightroom 3 as part of a package of software I bought from amazon about a year ago.I think that initially I assumed that it was only just a file management system for photos, and for whatever reason just never bothered with it.

I installed it on my MacBookPro and it seems a bit easier to navigate than elements. Tried a raw image and had an issue where the file wouldnt load at all. At least LR gave me a message telling me I needed to update in order to use cr2 files. Looked to see about getting a plug in but couldnt find one. I had to update from LR 3.5 to 3.6. That was a 112 mb file I needed to download and living in the land of sand the internet is horrible here. I waited until bedtime, and went for the download. It showed as being an hour and a half to download, but I went to sleep and it was complete this morning.

Installed 3.6 and seems to work fine with cr2 files. Will have to play around with it in the next couple of days.

[Alandb]

LR is a very good file management system, and a whole lot more. I hope you enjoy it.