Nikon Df

[GrahamS]

Finally!

It's FX (Full frame), it has NO movie functions, it has a metal body, it may just be the worlds first REAL Nikon digital camera, not an electrical appliance!

[Black Pearl]

Best sensor they've ever made, fantastic clicky dials, excellent build and in silver really rather spectacular - "Dear Santa"

[GrahamS]

I want a camera that......


Is a "full frame" 24x36mm DSLR, with an optical mirror box viewfinder and instant return mirror, with a viewfinder image coverage of 100% and a magnification of 95% and an eyepiece relief distance that allows the user to wear glasses and still see the info bar at the bottom of the viewfinder screen. The viewfinder should be purely mechanical i.e. it should not have a "live" LCD overlay screen as used by Canon in the 7D/5D and should be just like an Olympus OM1. It should have interchangeable focussing screens.


I want a camera that is the size and weight of a Nikon FM3 and has the build, finish and ergonomics of a Pentax K3. I want a camera that has NO movie capability whatsoever. I want a camera that has the rear LCD screen of the Nikon D7100, articulated to allow high and low level viewing with automatic brightness according to the ambient light. I want a camera that has the Canon rotating command dial on the rear with a "Set" button in the centre. My camera should have a top LCD screen on the right, looking from the rear, and a locking, mode dial on the left, concentric with a shutter speed dial. The mode dial should allow a choice of Av, Tv, M and with user programmable modes P1, P2 and P3. and no more! The shutter speed dial should allow the selection of speeds from 1/4000 down to 1 sec and B, and have a green "Auto" setting. "Auto" mode would over-ride the mode setting and take control of all exposure settings, metering, drive mode and auto focus settings, as well as set Jpg picture capture only. The shutter release should come from a Pentax K5 and have DOF preview combined with the on/off switch around the shutter release button. It should have dual SD memory card slots (because the pins of CF card slots are too fragile and prone to fault). There would be only one control dial, below the shutter release button in front. This front dial would control the aperture setting IN ALL MODES! In all modes except "M" mode, the rear command dial (the big one next to the rear LCD screen) would set the exposure compensation, by default.


In an ideal world, the lens mount (and here I admit I have a quandry) should be Nikon F. However, I would prefer the aperture actuation to be electronic and not by means of a mechanical lever and spring mechanism, which contributes to vibration, harmonics and shake at the instant of exposure. That restricts the choice of lensmount to Canon EF as things stand at the moment. No bad thing as the range of Canon lenses is superb, and the "L" lenses are built tough.


I want a camera that only has (5) buttons on the left side of the LCD, as follows:


Top left, within easy reach of my left thumb - > (Display) - Pressing this once displays the last image taken. Pressing the (i) info button (see below) repeatedly while the last image (or any image) is visible cycles through the image information display modes: Image only, Large histogram superimposed across the bottom of the image as per the Pentax D5, EXIF and Meta data displayed alongside and below the image and multiple RGB and luminance histograms displayed alongside the image.

ISO - pressing this will show the range of ISO sensitivities on the LCD screen. 50, 100, 200, 400, 800, 1600 and 3200. Rotating the rear command dial will highlight each in succession and pressing the "Set" button will set the chosen ISO. There will be no selectable "Auto" ISO setting. The selected ISO should be displayed in the top LCD screen, as well as in the viewfinder.


WB -(White Balance) - Pressing this should bring up a choice of white balance settings the same as a Canon 1/5/7 D. Rotating the rear command dial should highlight each option and pressing the "Set" button will select the chosen option. There should be a "custom" option which should only require that an image of a mostly white or grey subject be captured while this option is highlighted, to set the white balance accordingly. An icon indication the set WB should be displayed in the viewfinder and on the top LCD.


Dr - (Drive) - Pressing this should display a list of the drive modes on the rear LCD. These should be S (Single shot), Cs (Continuous slow), Cf (Continuous fast) R (Remote) RMU (Remote Mirror Up) Q (Quiet). The option to set a delay of 2 or 10 or 30 seconds when using the remote, either IR or wired, should be available on the remote controller itself. Drive mode should be selectable electronically, NOT mechanically by a dial a' la' some Nikon camreas, so as to allow for the drive mode to be programmable within P1, P2 or P3.


Ps - (Picture Style) - Pressing this should display a choice of the usual Jpg picture styles i.e: Standard, Vivid, Portrait, Landscape, B&W. Selecting B&W and pressing the "Set" button should display the options for B&W filter simulation, i.e: Yellow, Red, Orange, Geen and None, with None as the default.


Immediately above the command dial and to the right of the rear LCD screen there should be an "Info" (i) button. Pressing this once should display a "Quick Control Screen" as per the Canon 5/7 D cameras. This should show all of the basic exposure settings in grid layout. Rotating the command dial would highlight each setting in sequence, pressing the "Set" button once would display a list of the options for that particular item, again, rotating the command dial would highlight each option in turn, and pressing "Set" again would select the highlighted option. Items in this screen should include battery condition, card slot allocation (Jpg slot 1, RAW slot 2, backup or overflow, image number, file name, copyright data and shutter count. There would be no menu containing reams of custom functions or any other settings. There would be no post capture editing or effects filters.


Beneath the "Info" button would be a "LV" live view button. This would initiate live view for image framing and critical focussing purposes. I include this feature as I know that many macro enthusiasts use live view as well as others, although I rarely use it.


On the top left of the prism housing, there should be a "Qual" button to select the Jpg image size, compression and RAW file recording, used in conjunction with the command dial. Options should be displayed on both the top and the rear LCD screens.


On the lower left of the mirror box there would be a button to set the AF mode, used in conjunction with the command dial, and incorporating a switch to disengage the auto AF. On the back of the camera, top right and positioned to fall beneath my right thumb, there should be an "AF-On" button to initiate the auto-focus i.e. permanent back button focus. The only time this would be disabled and auto focus initiation given to the shutter button would be when "Auto" mode was selected. Alongside this button, and recessed to a lower level, would be an auto exposure lock button (* or AEL).


On the top plate, in front of the top LCD screen, there should be a button to access the metering mode, used in conjunction with the rear command dial. Modes should include Matrix, Centre weighted average and 2 degree spot. Alongside this should be a "Green" button, Pentax style, pressing which should set the exposure when using OEM or non-communicating lenses. On the front, between the mirror box and the grip, would be a "RAW" button, pressing which when picture quality is set to Jpg only, would result in the capture of a RAW file.


There would be no "menus" or screen after screen of custom functions. It would be more camera and less electrical appliance. The shutter would have a nominal life of 200 000 actuations.


Connectivity would include a live feed for tethered viewing of live view or captured image playback on a tablet, (with the necessary software supplied on a CD) as well as a USB port for connection to a PC or laptop and a wired remote control 1.5mm socket. Built in Wi-Fi connectivity as well as built in GPS data would be provided. There would also be a "universal" 12 volt DC power supply input which would also serve to charge the battery when connected.


There would be a built-in AF assist lamp which would double as an off-camera IR flash commander and trigger. There would be no built-in pop-up flash. The battery would give at least 900 exposures without using live view. There would be a battery grip capable of taking six AA batteries or two Ni-Mh batteries shaped like the grip for the Pentax K5. Image stabilization would be built in to the sensor, as would auto levelling and dust removal. Image stabilization would also be available as a lens feature. A Quick Menu Screen item would allow sensor stabilization to be deactivated. Neck-strap attachment would be by traditional lugs, not slots. However, there would be provision for the attachment of a hand-strap on the right side without requiring the attachment of the battery grip.


So, Mr Canon, do you have what it takes.........?


I wrote the above in the last week of October 2013, and intended to post it to my blog but hadn't got round to doing that yet, when Nikon seemed to have read my mind by announcing the Nikon Df. I haven't done a line by line comparison of the Df's specification with my desired camera, but apart from the lens mount being of necessity, Nikon F, I think it's pretty darn close! Bravo, Nikon. Now you just need to lower the price tag..........

[AB26]

A real have to have camera! (Sorry for the Canon Guys )

[DanK]

I can't see the attraction. From a first look, they changed a few things:

--an inconsequential change: making the exposed metal silver-colored. Graham, at least in the Canon world, high-end DSLRs all have metal bodies, and it's not clear that the better polycarbonate bodies are actually any less functional. My two Canon DSLRs are metal. Having the exposed metal black has been common on high-end SLRs, including Nikons, at least since the early 1970s, although it used to be a shiny black.

--using a retro box that is closer to a rectangular prism. I still get nostalgic when I take out my old FTb, which looks much like this new camera (except that the exposed metal was black--common on higher-end SLRs back in the early 1970s). However, the fact is that both of my DSLRs are considerably more comfortable to hold.

--apparently (from the picture) putting a lot of the controls on top. This seems to me to be undesirable. With my newer Canon, I can control a wide variety of functions--including aperture, shutter speed, ISO, and even the location of the AF points--without moving the camera or my hands from shooting position.

All in all, from just the picture, it looks like a step backwards to me.

Graham, I just scanned your list, but yes, a lot of what you are asking for is available on Canons, although some in different forms. E.g.:

On the lower left of the mirror box there would be a button to set the AF mode, used in conjunction with the command dial, and incorporating a switch to disengage the auto AF.

Check out the controls of a Canon 5DIII. You can do all this and more without moving your hand, depending on how you set the camera up. There is an AF button on the top, within reach of your index finger. You can change how many AF points are active and move the active area around the frame. If you put AF on the back button, you can move back and forth between AF and MF without changing anything, if you have Canon USM lenses, all of which have full-time manual focusing. (I do this most of the time.)

As nostalgic as I get about my old DSLR, I have no desire to go backwards.

[GrahamS]

I can't see the attraction. From a first look, they changed a few things:

--an inconsequential change: making the exposed metal silver-colored. Graham, at least in the Canon world, high-end DSLRs all have metal bodies, and it's not clear that the better polycarbonate bodies are actually any less functional. My two Canon DSLRs are metal. Having the exposed metal black has been common on high-end SLRs, including Nikons, at least since the early 1970s, although it used to be a shiny black.

--using a retro box that is closer to a rectangular prism. I still get nostalgic when I take out my old FTb, which looks much like this new camera (except that the exposed metal was black--common on higher-end SLRs back in the early 1970s). However, the fact is that both of my DSLRs are considerably more comfortable to hold.

--apparently (from the picture) putting a lot of the controls on top. This seems to me to be undesirable. With my newer Canon, I can control a wide variety of functions--including aperture, shutter speed, ISO, and even the location of the AF points--without moving the camera or my hands from shooting position.

All in all, from just the picture, it looks like a step backwards to me.

Graham, I just scanned your list, but yes, a lot of what you are asking for is available on Canons, although some in different forms. E.g.:



Check out the controls of a Canon 5DIII. You can do all this and more without moving your hand, depending on how you set the camera up. There is an AF button on the top, within reach of your index finger. You can change how many AF points are active and move the active area around the frame. If you put AF on the back button, you can move back and forth between AF and MF without changing anything, if you have Canon USM lenses, all of which have full-time manual focusing. (I do this most of the time.)

As nostalgic as I get about my old DSLR, I have no desire to go backwards.

Where's your soul???

This is not going backwards, it's a giant leap forwards but in another direction!!

[AB26]

It is worth reading this:

http://www.nikon.com/news/2013/1105_...medium=twitter
http://photographylife.com/nikon-df-pictures-pricing

[Polar01]

Looks nice in a retro type of way, however how much better is it, this camera will appeal to the cool trendy people. Yes I would like to see something from Nikon maybe in say something like a D4 stripped of video but saving live view, remove that settings button driven menu and replace it with the old style as now found on the D600. Remove all those camera pre-sets that Jpegs shooter use, if you are using this class of camera you do not need them, new sensor similar to those in the D600/D610/D7100. Keep all the best that the D4 has to offer. NOW THAT WILL GET ME EXCITED. This is just a marketing con job that the herd will rush out to get, but than again isn't running with the herd what the cool and hip do.
Sorry for small rant, but it was my time for it.

Cheers:

Allan

[PhotomanJohn]

As one who is (was) about ready to buy a D800, I find the introduction of this camera very interesting. Being that the price of the Df is the same as the street price of a D800, it is worth some of my time to consider this camera. Having used for years the early Nikon's that the Df is patterned after, it has a familiar and friendly look and probably feel to it. Also to date I have never taken a video with any of my DSLRs so the lack of that capability in the Df is not much of an issue to me. For me the improved low light capability of the Df is probably more important than the higher resolution of the D800. The reduced size and weight is nice but one sacrifices a more comfortable grip and the added stability when hand holding. The external dials are a wash to me as well as the lack of internal flash.

The decision between the two reminds me of a decision I make most every day. Do I want to carry my heavy Swiss Army knife or my lighter convention folding pocket knife? Most of the time I only use the knife feature of the heavier knife. I am able to go back and forth on that question but can't afford the same luxury in the case of these two cameras. I think the introduction of the Df at least deserves the delay in the purchasing of a new camera.

John

[Manfred M]

Damn - if they had only brought back the aperture ring on the lenses we would feel that we were back in the 20th century. Gee drop that autofocus too while we are at it.

A camera with less capability than a D610, at roughly the same price as a D800?. Sorry folks, I look for features, not nostalgia when I look at camera bodies; functionality, rather than "bling". I find it scary when companies have to look to the past to sell products...

[Black Pearl]

It's not half a D610 it's half a D4 - and that makes a big difference.

[GrahamS]

I think they doth protest too much........

[NorthernFocus]

...A camera with less capability than a D610, at roughly the same price as a D800?. Sorry folks, I look for features, not nostalgia when I look at camera bodies; functionality, rather than "bling". I find it scary when companies have to look to the past to sell products...

After that awesome marketing campaign to build us up, then they lauch this dud. IMO, the Df is testing two things with the camera using public.
1) Mental IQ test, will people pay more money for less features than other cameras marketed by the same manufacturer?
2) State of the economy/disposable income test, will people spend more money for less features than other cameras marketed by the same manufacturer just because they think it looks cool?

This is like the Rolex vs. Timex digital comparison. For under $50US you can have a watch with more functions than you could ever use including monitoring your heart rate, or for $5000US you can have a watch that tells time and looks really cool.

That should have been there marketing campaign. "Hey, do you own a Rolex? Then you've gotta have one of these..."

[DanK]

This looks like my first DSLR, a Mamiya Sekor that I bought in 1968 in part because it was, well, cheap. I was a student. In 1972, when that broke and I was no longer a student, I bought a Canon FTb, which offered, in addition to superb optics, a black top, a chance to get rid of that tacky silver color. But I digress.

Here is a simple thought experiment. If Nikon offered the exact same functions in two versions at the same price, one packed into a 610 body and the other in this Mamiya-Sekor cousin, which would you buy? If many people would choose the latter, well, then I think Nikon has found a way to turn DSLRs into a fashion accessory. All the manufactures have long since done this with point-and-shoots.

On a more serious note, I agree that stripping out video would please a lot of still photographers, including me, if the savings showed up either as a lower cost to the consumer or additional features for still photography. I recently splurged on a 5D Mark III, which is a truly wonderful camera, and I worked systematically through most of the options and menus. (The manual is 400 pp. long!) I almost entirely skipped the video part. I took a short video just for the heck of it and then moved on to what (for me) matters. But that notwithstanding, the camera is worlds better than my old SLRS that looked like this new Nikon, and one part of that is the big improvements in ergonomics.

PS: My watch is a Casio that costs only slightly more than a replacement band, so I am clearly not in the Rolex camp.

[dubaiphil]

After that awesome marketing campaign to build us up, then they lauch this dud. IMO, the Df is testing two things with the camera using public.
1) Mental IQ test, will people pay more money for less features than other cameras marketed by the same manufacturer?
2) State of the economy/disposable income test, will people spend more money for less features than other cameras marketed by the same manufacturer just because they think it looks cool?

This is like the Rolex vs. Timex digital comparison. For under $50US you can have a watch with more functions than you could ever use including monitoring your heart rate, or for $5000US you can have a watch that tells time and looks really cool.

That should have been there marketing campaign. "Hey, do you own a Rolex? Then you've gotta have one of these..."

The watch comparison is hardly valid, as Rolex (or any other high value branded watch) are generally kept for a lifetime, or several lifetimes. How would you feel if a loved one left a Casio to you in their last will and testament?!?

Not that I'm defending Rolex - I'm not a fan myself. More of a Panerai and IWC kinda guy.

The fact that the Df brings a top of the range (in the current market) sensor, as long as you're not a MP fanboy, into a more compact body harks back to the D700. No video - no problem for a lot of people. Unfortunately it's then been crippled somewhat with the D610's AF.

Looks retro, yes, and in the picture at the top of the thread it looks compact too. But is that a new 58mm f1.4 on board with a much larger filter thread than traditional 58mm thread f1.4G or f1.8G Nikkors - I think so. Pop one of them on board and it looks a lot more clunky and nowhere near as compact.

I've been waiting for a D700 replacement and now there one that's sort of here I don't want it.

I can't help thinking that a leaf shutter rangefinder with full frame sensor and with a small range of f1.4 and f2 lenses over time in the 21-75mm range would be a far better segment to enter. Think Leica M240 but 1/2 the price, ISO capable up to 200,000 but fully useable up to 50,000 (read that and weep, Leica boys), and with Leica adaptors to take Leica, Voight, Zeiss lenses as well. Now you're talking. Think Zeiss Ikon, yet digital, with a full frame sensor and high ISO capable.

And yes, Nikon manufactured rangefinders in the past to bring up to date and look as retro as possible.

And yes, it would look just as cool.

I'd get one of those.

[Black Pearl]

A couple of points.

I'll get the watch comparison out the way first as its the most ridiculous.
A £50 Timex has a mass produced - quartz - movement whereas a Rolex (Phil I'd rather have an IWC too) has a hand made Automatic movement AND once you take the Timex it home is worth 50p, Keep a £5000 Rolex or other luxury brand watch for a few years and it will still be worth £5000....sometimes even more.

Now to the Df.

If we put aside the styling for a moment what you have is a D700 - in that Nikon have released a baby D4 in the same way as the D700 was a baby D3. In the same way they deliberately crippled the D700 to stop any chance of it eating into D3 sales that have dropped specs on the Df to stop you buying one instead of a D4.
The D700 had a crappy viewfinder, a single card slot, no video and a lack of pace - the D300s of the same time which is essentially the same camera with a DX chip in it had all of those but wouldn't pinch D3 buyers away.
Now I'm not saying that is right but it isn't new.

People are getting too hung up on the styling element and forget you have a D4 sensor for less money.

[dubaiphil]

A couple of points.

I'll get the watch comparison out the way first as its the most ridiculous.
A £50 Timex has a mass produced - quartz - movement whereas a Rolex (Phil I'd rather have an IWC too) has a hand made Automatic movement AND once you take the Timex it home is worth 50p, Keep a £5000 Rolex or other luxury brand watch for a few years and it will still be worth £5000....sometimes even more.

Now to the Df.

If we put aside the styling for a moment what you have is a D700 - in that Nikon have released a baby D4 in the same way as the D700 was a baby D3. In the same way they deliberately crippled the D700 to stop any chance of it eating into D3 sales that have dropped specs on the Df to stop you buying one instead of a D4.
The D700 had a crappy viewfinder, a single card slot, no video and a lack of pace - the D300s of the same time which is essentially the same camera with a DX chip in it had all of those but wouldn't pinch D3 buyers away.
Now I'm not saying that is right but it isn't new.

People are getting too hung up on the styling element and forget you have a D4 sensor for less money.

Crippled the D700? Same autofocus and sensor as the D3, methinks. The AF was definitely a step up from the D300 anyway. And it's coverage across the frame is larger than the D600 (I haven't been bothered to look and check if the focus point coverage has changed between the 600 and 610, but after reviewing a 600 for a local magazine when it was released this was a limiting factor to me). I've never missed a second slot, but if I was shooting weddings and the like then maybe I'd need it.
Crappy viewfinder? C'mon, please! Hardly. I have very very rarely missed the 3% that I don't see, and when moving up from a D90/300/7000 etc it's big bright and beautiful! Lack of pace? Compared to what? The 5D MkII? I don't think so. Chuck in some batteries into the grip and you've got 8FPS for the incredibly rare times you may need it. The main difference was the shutter actuations, rated at 150k vs. 300k I think. I think the relative crippling of the feature set of the Df is to limit the poaching of sales from the D4, compared to lessons learnt from the D700 vs. D3.

That D4 sensor performance really really does tempt me though. I'd want to love this camera, and I probably would love it if I got my hands on it.

This is finally the sort of D700 replacement, but with lots of dials and ornaments. It does look good though...

Mmm - my IWC Pilot looks good too

[Venser]

This is finally the sort of D700 replacement, but with lots of dials and ornaments.

I don't get people who say this. I have no clue how many of you hold your camera, but ergonomically I'd rather have my D700 in hand than my Olympus OM-D E-M5, of which this DF has some semblance. The hand grip on the right side of the D700 means I can have my 70-200 hanging off the mount and the camera balances perfectly in my fingers without having to close my grip. Not going to happen with this camera. When my D700 dies, I'm picking up the D4, or the next upgrade since I'm not a MP fanboy (looking at you D800). I want a camera I can carry around without requiring a continuous closed grip.

[Green Mountain Girl]

Damn - if they had only brought back the aperture ring on the lenses we would feel that we were back in the 20th century. Gee drop that autofocus too while we are at it.

A camera with less capability than a D610, at roughly the same price as a D800?. Sorry folks, I look for features, not nostalgia when I look at camera bodies; functionality, rather than "bling". I find it scary when companies have to look to the past to sell products...

Hi Manfred.
I have also wondered what the reasoning is behind the Df! But I plan to use it to my advantage. Nikon has already started putting an "on sale" sign on the D800, so hopefully it will go down some more once the product is fully launched... Then I will be better able to afford one.

So all you people who want the Df, I urge you to buy it so I can get a D800 at a less expensive price... Thank you.

Susan

[RustBeltRaw]

I like the fact that Nikon is thinking hard about how to make a still camera for photographers. Dropping video features and increasing external controls is, in general, a welcome change. Luminous Landscape's "Apeal for Divergence" has been (at least partially) answered.

Apprently I'm not the only one with reservations, because initial sales are apparently below targets, and the D800 and D610 are both outselling the DF. I'd prefer to use the camera before passing judgement, but I wonder how much you're paying for the aesthetics? It looks undeniably sweet, but I'm not sure the one-handed, eye-in-viewfinder exposure compensation, aperture, ISO and shutter speed adjustments enabled by modern ergonomics are possible with this cam. But if it stirs your soul, no one can talk you out of that $2,800. For a retro experience, I'll stick with my Zenza.