Monitors/displays

[Lana1412]

Hi, everyone, I hope this isn't one of those topics that has been discussed too much.
So, to put things as simply as possible...

I have a Dell laptop, no clue what's inside it because it was a gift, not something I specifically built. Not that I have a clue how to build laptops as of yet. Either way, it's lack of IPS really bothers me and has taken the joy out of editing. Having to tilt the screen to find the sweet spot, not being able to move an inch during editing. It sucks. As does not being able to confidently send images off to be printed. I'm in need of a new, much more beefed up laptop but since I don't have the money to buy a new laptop and a new monitor, I've decided the monitor is more important at this time. So i've been looking into one anywhere from 24 to 27 inches depending on price. Ideally it would be the NEC 24" with SV 2. After a long time of googling about the best monitors for editing photography theres been a trend in information. People say low budget monitors (like those 300 dollar Dell's and Asus and so on..) aren't good enough and Amazon/B&H reviews say they come with way too many problems. The higher quality NEC's AND EIZO's are spoken very well of though but are pricey. Another problem seems to be that while there are people who recommend the higher quality displays, there are people who advise against them because they say these displays take time to master and are complicated and unnecessary if you aren't working strictly or mostly in the aRGB colorspace.

Here are my questions..

Firstly, what setup do you have for photography?

Do you think paying 600 to 800 more for an NEC over a 300 dollar Dell would be an acceptable and effective investment if one were to mainly use the NEC in sRGB emulation and 8 bit across the board? I have lightroom as my main editing program and don't yet have ps.

Would using a wide gamut display primarily in sRGB mode benefit the editing process over editing on one of the low to mid budget displays? Othen than allowing me to edit images in aRGB for print and saving another edit of the same print in sRGB for the web.

Can I send off my images to be printed and get well matched prints, or send off images to publications, while editing on a lower to mid budget ips display?

Keep in mind that i know very little about computers, as is probably obvious. I just want a great display that will help me do my images justice on the web and in print. I've read a bunch of threads where people have asked similar questions and I haven't read a solution that i'm happy with, which is my I've decided to start asking too. I'm not afraid to learn btw. I'm self taught and that means a lot of reading and youtube tutorials lol So, i know at this point the NEC 24' is more of a machine than I need currently since im looking to hook it up to my not very powerful dell laptop and work with lightroom, but I'm up to the challenge of having a good display I can count on, learn how to use properly, and that will hold its own for the next 6 + years. But if it really is more than I need right now and theres a less expensive but really quality display out there, i'll take it. It just needs to be a really good product, which i know isn't always easy to find under $1,000. Plus, if i buy the nec, i'll be tapped out of cash for a very long time.

[HaseebM]

Welcome to CiC Lana!

I have some experience with Monitors as I used to game a lot and fast response times and good colour calibration to bring out the eye candy was a must. However, a few years back, IPS panels were expensive and even the likes of Alienware came out with TN ( Twisted Neumatic ) panels to ease the cost. In the meantime I had experiences using right from 20" to 24" inches from brands such as Asus, Benq, Dell, Viewsonic and finally I came across a good review on Dell's SP2309W. I got that and never looked back. Colours are natural and comparable to what I see on most IPS panels. Having said this, I do have a Graphics card ( Nvidia GTX 560 ti ) which helps in calibrating the monitor to depict true to life pictures. Its not 100% but close enough. If you are lucky enough to find this model, get it right away. Fortunately though, IPS monitors have now begun sprouting up amongst various brands and at attractive price points, so check out some reviews and see what best suits your model.

[yauman]

Here's a very good UK site that evaluates high end monitors.
I bought the 27" Dell Ultrasharp U2713H about 6 months ago which was very well reviewed on this site and it love it. Cost about US$900 but definitely worth it. It can handle gerzillion different types of video inputs, from hdmi to minidisplay ports. It's also a USB 3 hub! Highly programmable and comes with it's own calibrator program (a lobotomized version of X-rites' i1DisplayPro calibrator software) Of course that forced me to buy the i1DisplayPro calibrator!

[davidedric]

Hi there,

I use a Dell Ultrasharp 23" IPS monitor that I bought around 18 months ago. Cost around 200 UK pounds, and is certainly good enough for me. I am not a professional, but I do like to get things right. I use LR 5.2, and Nik plug-ins.

Whatever monitor you get, it is very important that you also get a calibration device. Otherwise your investment will be wasted.

Colour space and colour management are a whole very big topic (have a look at the tutorials on this site if you haven't already).

You post talks about editing and printing. This recent thread may help there: Printing - sRGB and Adobe questions

One key point is that your local printer will almost certainly be printing using sRGB, so that is what you will need to output. (A RAW image doesn't really "have" a colour space until it is output).

If your version of LR is 4 or higher, then you also have access to softproofing. For this to be most useful, you also need to have the profile for the paper/printer combination that your print shop is using - which they may or may not be willing to provide!

Hope this helps - you'll likely get a fair number of responses here.

Dave

[ajohnw]

I use a 27in Dell ultra sharp that comes pre calibrated to sRGB also their zero dead pixel guarantee. Prior to that I calibrated my monitor and to be frank I can't really see any difference of consequence on shots adjusted on that when viewed on the Dell so I am in no rush to calibrate it. I am at a stage where I notice that I tend to post images that are too bright and one or two other things and need to go away for a while and view later before posting. My processing still has some way to go too.

If you want to look at various monitor colour accuracies this is a good site to look at.

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/

If you get into using calibrators this site is rather useful.

http://www.northlight-images.co.uk/reviews.html

You may find that this site uses Argll colour management at times or mentions it. You may want to look at that too. It allows complete end to end calibration at a level only usually available in spectroscope type calibrators. Affordable calibrators often just show a before and after picture which in real terms is useless.

http://www.argyllcms.com/

They are all no punches pulled sites. I use no other types.

On printing in Adobe RGB I think it's a case of likes the colours rather than a sensible thing to do. The colour eye candy should be adjusted during processing.

John
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[chauncey]

Several years ago when I decided to get serious about photography and PP, my searches for "the best" monitor lead me to a NEC PA271w, for which I paid an obscene amount of money. Andrew Rodney, http://digitaldog.net/ is my quintessential "go to guy" for all things relating to color/softproofing/related thingys...read his treatises.
Like I said, that was years ago and I can only assume that there are more reasonably priced monitors now available, although...I would question the use of laptops for serious PP work and softproofing. The calibration suggestions, take them to the bank.

[bambleweeney]

I bought an Eizo FS2333-BK (23") a few months back after the demise of my secondary monitor. After doing a lot of research on price and functionality between practically all the manufacturers I dropped on this one and after calibration I have to say that I'm really pleased with it. Top of the list for me was colour reproduction and with my on screen grey scale this reproduced more distinct tones than my primary monitor - which has now been relegated to monitor no. 2. Pretty much full sRGB coverage and a not inconsiderable chunk of AdobeRGB as well. It finally came down to a choice between this and the Dell but on reviews the Eizo was marginally better.
Also constructed lke a brick outhouse and a (surprisingly useful) remote control included.

Review here :-
http://www.prad.de/en/monitore/revie...bk-part11.html
on a site that tells you way more about monitors than you really need to know ....
Price a bit of a shocker at about 300 Euros (whatever that is in real money)

[Black Pearl]

The problem with the internet and trying to get an answer is there is far far too much twaddle typed on far far too many sites.

For all but the most extreme tolerance needs a 'decent' monitor will be perfectly acceptable and paying a huge amount more - while nice if you have the cash - simply isn't needed.
The Dell monitors you talk about are excellent, will more than match your needs and for the vast majority of people are....and this is the critical bit....good enough.

[Lana1412]

Wow, so many responses. Thank you all so much for taking the time. I'll look up each of your suggestions.

[whited3]

Hi all.

With a budget <$500 I don't think the Dell offerings (U2414H & U2412M models) compare well against the Asus PA248Q or AOC i2757. I am leaning towards the Asus but would welcome any other recommendations or comments.

Cheers.

[ajohnw]

You could take a look around this site to make your mind up. Personally I like the 3 year Dell guarantee but their cost in that respect is probably included in what they cost. On the other hand I have had a monitor fail in around 18 months. Only one but it was a relatively expensive one.

http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews.htm

I had a quick nose on the site and noticed for instance that the AOC uses a 6bit panel plus time switched dithering to obtain 8. Asus too. Don't know which Dell you are looking at. On the other hand I am ditherphobic. The very word makes me shiver due to it's use in grey scales for middle grey set up and it's early use on colour monitors. I probably wouldn't notice the time switched variety.

One type of monitor I most certainly wouldn't buy are the low dpi types. There are often 2 resolutions offered on a number of sizes. I wouldn't buy the lower one especially for photography. They don't really offer increased screen space if some one is moving up in size either. Just make things bigger.

John
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[dabhand]

FWIW - I've had an ASUS for nearly 2 years now and I can't fault it - I've almost given up on calibration as it does not appear to drift. The 1920x1200 resolution is also a benefit when doing non-photo stuff.

[Loose Canon]

I roll the same way Lana. As in laptop plus external monitor.

I’ve been looking at an Asus ProArt PA249Q 24″. It has pretty good specs/reviews from what I have seen.

There is a little said (very little) here.

[rpcrowe]

I have one comment... Buy the largest monitor that you can afford. IMO, the difference in editing using a 27-inch display and a 24-inch display is significant.

Additionally, there are fewer monitor manufacturers than computer companies. I don't know if this is true now but, the Dell monitors were once made by Samsung and I believe that several other companies also subcontract their monitors from Samsung.

I used an NEC monitor but, was disappointed because it lasted just past the warranty time. I have been using a Samsung 27-inch monitor for several years now and I am quite happy with it. Perhaps if I were doing advertising photography in which the slightest color balance shift is not allowed, I might purchase a more expensive monitor (but, perhaps not!),

Whatever monitor you use, calibrating the monitor is critical...

[FrankMi]

When I did my research several years ago, nothing could top the LG Flatron W2600H for size (26") price and performance. I would expect that this monitor has been updated by now but it has performed flawlessly from day one and has proven itself to be the best price conscious outstanding performing computer related purchase I've made.

[ajohnw]

The site I linked to often mentions what make of panel is actually fitted into a particular monitor. There are even less companies that actually make those.

The site is also useful for sorting out bargains if a calibrator is available. My previous monitor was a ViewSonic. It calibrated rather well. They also give suitable contrast and brightness settings for using as a basis for calibration and last time I looked provide profiles for the monitors that they have reviewed.

John
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[whited3]

I ended up with the Asus ProArt PA248Q for $395. First impressions are great. In sRGB mode (factory calibrated) the only change I made when calibrating to the Spyder4Pro was brightness, otherwise the monitor was just about perfect out of the box.

Controls are buttons, not sensor touch and are easy to use. On board 4 port USB 3 hub, the monitor can rotate to the vertical, there's a button that superimposes a grid on the screen in cms, inches, A4, and standard photo sizes.

I would have liked something bigger but they are well outside my budget.

[Loose Canon]

Hi Mark,

Nice to hear your impressions. I haven't pulled the trigger on one of these monitors yet so I'm curious.

Thanks for that.