Light Painting steam

[Tommy49]

I would like to photograph a still life that includes a steaming cup of hot coffee. I prefer to do it using the painting with light technique because I want the total black backround. Question; can you, or is it even possible to capture the steam with the typical long exposures required for this technique?

Any suggestions?

[William W]

Interesting question. I haven’t attempted to light paint steam as a Photograph, but in theory, is does not make sense to me to do so. I do a reasonable amount of Light Painting. Light Painting works best for stationary subjects: and steam is moving.

Flash would be the best (theoretical) solution: but I have not done that, either. For a simple experiment if I was posed the question in a practical class - I would first look at Flash as the Key Light, from the side, with a Black Velvet Background behind the steam.

Someone who has done it, hopefully will provide a more concrete answer.

WW

[GrahamH]

Try flash from behind the steam. Flag the background so it is unaffected. If you can't flag the cup so reflections don't show, double exposure and photoshop (one without lighting the steam).
Hope that helps.
Graham

[Carl in Louisiana]

Google "Photographing Steam" and you'll get plenty of ideas. Looking forward to yours photo's.

[Andrew76]

I think Bill, and Graham hit it dead on.

Light painting is not a practical technique here. I've never photo'd steam, but I have tried smoke from an incense stick, several times.

I use a desk light to illuminate the smoke, so you have something to focus on, and then a flash to capture the shot. Can even use gels if you want to have some fun with colour. But you do need to flag the flashes though, or suffer the consequences in post processing!!

[deetheturk]

Hi Tommy,

Stagecoach(Grahame)has a thread on here called smoke and heat,this is a similar technique to what you are trying to do,he has also explained in detail how his end result was achieved,have a look and i'm sure you will get some idea's.

Cheers David

[Stagecoach]

Tommy,

One option is to use flash and light behind the steam as in this tutorial but you will need up to three flashes.

http://digital-photography-school.co...-cup-of-coffee

It may well work with a long exposure using ambient or low powered fixed lights with a short burst of low power flash to capture the steam.

Grahame

[John 2]

This needs PS.
Photograph your steam against a dead black BG (i.e. no reflections) by whatever method works best. PP it to produce a reasonably contrasty image (in the steam tones not between the steam and the BG). Copy and paste the steam over your second image then merge the two layers using the "screen" setting. Flatten your image.
Merging with screen eliminated the black. Grey tones become semi translucent so that some of your background image begins to show through which is what you would want. White remains totally opaque.

[Stagecoach]

Tommy,

Having an option tonight of shooting macro and a nice specimen cockroach I decided steaming coffee may be easier but I was WRONG. So here's an attempt I had which I have to say is the best of thirty.

This was done using an off camera flash SB600 in manual and triggered from the camera. The flash with an extension tube (rectangular piece of cardboard around 7" long) was placed behind the cup and pointing up towards and against the top of the cup as close as I could get it without it being in the pic. The power was adjusted to get the best steam affect around 1/2 with my unit.

I then simply used ambient light overhead and wall lights (different colours)for the mug and set exposure for this manually which was 2" seconds at f16. If I had of had time I would have simply lit the mug with two separate flashes.

So again, like the recent mosquito coil and smoke shot the long exposure takes care of the scene and the flash freezes the steam. I could not achieve decent results using flash from the side as it blew out the cup.

May be of use to you.



Grahame

[William W]

. . .Having an option tonight of shooting macro and a nice specimen cockroach I decided steaming coffee may be easier but I was WRONG. So here's an attempt I had which I have to say is the best of thirty.

I take my hat off to you and buy you a Single Malt Scotch: I stated it was an interesting question and set about to have a crack at it . . . I am still planning how best to have a crack at it.

Attention Colin and Dave et al: This should be a competition. "The Steaming Cup of Coffee"



WW

[Tommy49]

I take my hat off to you and buy you a Single Malt Scotch: I stated it was an interesting question and set about to have a crack at it . . . I am still planning how best to have a crack at it.

Attention Colin and Dave et al: This should be a competition. "The Steaming Cup of Coffee"



WW

Thanks everybody for your tips and links. Unfortunatly, I don't own an off-camera flash but did get some good ideas for an alternate remedy (I hope). I'll give them a try but doubt it will be easy. Seems like back-lighting is the ticket, just need to figure out how to do it without off-camera flash!

[wlou]

Hello Tommy, Interesting challenge! I do "LightPainting" and I think it could be done. First with normal light, get focus , turn the lights off, start long exposure. With flashlight "Paint" your smoke first and then your cup,stop long exposure. I do not know what you use for steam. From my reading regular coffee steam does not stay very long. You probably will have to use something else, incense comes to mind. Have fun.

[Stagecoach]

Tommy,

How will you be lighting your scene? Do you intend to use on camera flash, ambient daylight light or studio type lights.

From my experiment last night side lighting gave equivalent steam 'quality' as back lighting BUT I had the problem that the flash power required was too much for the cup.

As steam is constantly moving around any long exposure of it using light painting may cause it to be very blurred. I suspect the temperature of the room may also things somewhat.

Grahame

[William W]

Seems like back-lighting is the ticket, just need to figure out how to do it without off-camera flash!

and

How will you be lighting your scene? Do you intend to use on camera flash, ambient daylight light or studio type lights.

I was sitting outside this morning about 2 hours after sunrise, drinking my coffee.

There is an hedge 20mtrs away from where I sit and I could position the coffee cup such that it was framed with the hedge behind it and the hedge would appear black in the final shot if I made a Photograph.

The sunlight, lit the steam "perfectly": and the sun was high enough not to be in shot but there was slight breeze and the steam dissipated too broadly for my liking.

On a still morning or in a protected 'no wind' environment it would have been a good shot to make.

I was not motivated enough this morning to stop drinking the coffee go inside and upstairs to get my kit and find a wind free spot and make a photograph - but at least I have moved forward with my plan: and if I can I’ll make the shot using only Available Light.


WW

[Stagecoach]

Bill,

More thoughts that came to mind whilst sitting outside my favourite cafe in town today having my morning cuppa, reading the paper and watching the world go by as the tourists from the cruise ship are being hassled.

There is a major difference between capturing steam than smoke in that smoke is solid particles and steam is water droplets.

Steam captured with flash as my example above has frozen the water droplets due to the very short duration of light and gives a 'coarse' affect. Increasing the flash power will extend the light duration but I suspect give too many problems to overcome with the flash falling on the static parts of the scene.

So it appears there is a need to control the lighting duration on the steam to get it smoother but not too smooth to the extent where you just have one big steam blur.

This raises the question as to what the ideal 'duration' is? More experimentation.

Grahame

[William W]

Grahame,

This is now becoming bigger than Ben Hur!

I too have been thinking about "correct" the Shutter Speed (regarding only Available Light Capture).

It is perhaps a restriction for me that my brain is wired such wants to seek out the answer before I have a practical attempt at it . . . meanwhile I am drinking way too much coffee whilst I ponder about the “correct” Tv for my first practical experiment.

Regards,

Bill

[Colin Southern]

Just a couple of quick thoughts:

- If you're going to do it, don't make the exposure too long or it'll make the steam look like it's coming out the back of a jet engine.

- Often things like this need or benefit from an off-axis strobe

If folks want to make it a competition, go for it -- just start a thread in the competitions forum and I'm sure Dave, Donald, or I can provide any moderation as and when required.

[rpcrowe]

When I needed steam as a cinematographer, I used dry ice with some water on it. Makes clouds of neat "steam".

[Tommy49]

This is what I ended up with. I don't have off camera flash so I positioned a small snooted flashlight behind the coffee cup pointing straight up and used the dangling piece of white string technique to create the steam. I dangled the string with one hand and painted with light with the other. (Who said you can't walk and chew gum at the same time?) This was a 30 second exposure at f22

[wlou]

The dangling string technique hey, great idea! Now this is what light painting is all about. This may interest you : http://www.patrickrochon.com . A great light painter.