1st wedding as an amateur

[wellsie82]

Hi all,

First time poster here & I'm after a few pointers from people who have "been there & done it" when it comes to doing your first wedding.

I feel I'm reasonably kitted out & am not looking to change any of my gear prior to the wedding having changed some of my gear already over the past year. I have made a bit of money selling images via getty & other stock sites but this is the first time I've had someone come to me to ask me to take images for payment. He's also a close friend who I work with - I'm therefore looking to eliminate any silly mistakes & do my best for him.

Shooting people has never been my strong point but since being asked to do this wedding, I have made a concious effort to get out my comfort zone & most of the images on the following gallery have been shot in the last six months http://www.jasonwells.co.uk/Photography/People

Ok, so what have I got & what do I know?

Gear wise, I've got a 6d body & a backup 550d. 24-105mm with IS (good range of focal lengths but not the quickest), 70-300mm with IS, 50mm f1.8 & 85mm f1.8. I've got a Nissin DI 622 Mk2 flash gun with both a bracket to mount the flash slightly off camera, a cable to link the two, plus a remote transmitter/receiver. I've also got a shoot through umbrella, a small diffuser that "caps" on over the flash & a diffuser which I guess is the size of an A4 sheet of paper to soften light.

I'm confident in getting good exposures & generally shoot in aperture mode with a max ISO of 800-1200 in good light & up to 3200 indoors (to avoid noise) on my 6d. The 6d will be my main camera but I don't have a problem using the 550d with another lens on it.

I know my way round the exposure triangle in a sense your large aperture will nicely blur the background to make your subject stand out & a slower shutter speed can blur movement & bring in camera shake too.

My flash does not have TTL & with this in mind, I've had to practice placing the flash at certain distances from the subject and/or bumping the flashes power up/down. This has taken some getting used to, but the shots I've been getting have either been willing models who have kindly helped me or candids. Ie, I've never been in the situation where I've been under pressure to nail the exposure straight away before moving onto another shot.

My friend wants shots of people enjoying themselves but I am pushing him for a proper list because in years to come, he'll regret not getting "special" shots - I also know the posed shots is an expectation of me. The wedding is in two months, it'll be mainly be indoors due to the british weather, I'm yet to visit the venue but intend to within the next few weeks (my understanding is the walls are white, bright & modern which will give me scope to bounce flash to soften light).

So that's a quick summary of my gear & what I've done before - my questions & pointers I need are:-

* whats the best mode to work in? I don't have high sync flash & having a 3rd party flash I my max sync speed is 1/180 (1/200 on the 550d). Should I use shutter mode with the speed set to the max sync speed of the flash? Or should I stick to aperture priority mode with f4-5.6 for the couple & f8-11 for group shots to retain control over the DoF?

* what would my best lens be for the 6d? my 24-105mm probably gives me the best quality, followed by my 85mm. If I had my 85mm on my 550d it would end up as 100mm ish with the crop factor. Although I have more than two lenses, I'd like to be able to get away with just using these two for ease & to keep things simple

* are there any general tips for using a manual flash to remove the trial & error I mentioned earlier? Also, in AV mode my camera has three flash shooting speeds, auto, fixed (1/180) & one with a lower/upper limit 1/60-1/180). I would assume auto is not recommended & that fixed at 1/180 would offer more consistent results, but what are the thoughts between that & the 1/60-1/180 mode?

Sorry for the long post & I'm grateful for any assistance.

Jason
________________

[Shadowman]

Hi Jason,

Your people shots look pretty good. Your weak spot might be photographing indoors, different lighting situations, inability to use flash (depends on the venue). In the areas where you can use flash, consider setting up a spot that can be reused, that way you don't have to move any equipment later in the day. Will you have an assistant?

[Geoff F]

Yes that would be my first choice. An assistant using the back up camera so all possible errors would be covered.

I hate doing anything where I'm under pressure to produce perfect results.

People seem to think that they only have to pose once, for just one shot that will be perfect and get impatient when I want to take several angles with different settings to get that one shot which is a little bit different.

'I only have to take one shot with my phone camera so why do you need to take so many with all that kit'!

[wellsie82]

Thanks John - I've certainly made a convoys effort to get some practice in but as you say indoors will be different.

Yes my other half will be helping me but she's got no experience in photography but will be fine swapping lenses or holding things etc.

I normally shoot in aperture priority to retain control over my DoF, would you suggest I stay on this mode still?

The venue is a hotel/country house rather than a church so I'm sure I'll be allowed to use my manual flash throughout the day - however I'll confirm when I visit the venue beforehand.

[wellsie82]

Yes that would be my first choice. An assistant using the back up camera so all possible errors would be covered.

I hate doing anything where I'm under pressure to produce perfect results.

People seem to think that they only have to pose once, for just one shot that will be perfect and get impatient when I want to take several angles with different settings to get that one shot which is a little bit different.

'I only have to take one shot with my phone camera so why do you need to take so many with all that kit'!

I know exactly what you mean there. My assistant will be more physical support for me, holding the flash off camera, changing batteries etc only. We're both there as guests but her job will be to help me and not take pictures.

[Shadowman]

Thanks John - I've certainly made a convoys effort to get some practice in but as you say indoors will be different.

Yes my other half will be helping me but she's got no experience in photography but will be fine swapping lenses or holding things etc.

I normally shoot in aperture priority to retain control over my DoF, would you suggest I stay on this mode still?

The venue is a hotel/country house rather than a church so I'm sure I'll be allowed to use my manual flash throughout the day - however I'll confirm when I visit the venue beforehand.

Aperture priority will get you through most of the event, but there will still be times when manual will need to be called upon.

[Colin Southern]

Hi Jason,

A lot has been written here in the past about what you're intending -- so you might find this search useful ...

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/fo...earchid=708980

In addition to that, I'd suggest popping along to www.kelbytraining.com - sign up - and go through all the lessons from David Ziser.

[William W]

. . . when it comes to doing your first wedding . . .my questions & pointers I need are:-

* whats the best mode to work in? I don't have high sync flash & having a 3rd party flash I my max sync speed is 1/180 (1/200 on the 550d). Should I use shutter mode with the speed set to the max sync speed of the flash? Or should I stick to aperture priority mode with f4-5.6 for the couple & f8-11 for group shots to retain control over the DoF?

The “best” CAMERA MODE for YOU to work in will be the mode that YOU can CONTROL and not make mistakes whilst shooting under the pressure of time.

The fact that you do NOT have TTL is a major consideration when working with Flash. In this situation (for all Flash work), I would choose to work absolutely and without reservation ONLY in MANUAL MODE. My choice would be predicated on the facts that I would have to SET (or check) both the Shutter Speed and the Aperture manually before releasing the Shutter - and that discipline would be MY safety net.

On the other hand I see logic in your suggestion to use Tv Mode (Shutter Speed Priority) and to set the Tv at or just below the maximum sync speed of the camera.

I see more mistakes likely if you use Av Mode (Aperture Priority), because if you are distracted and NOT always monitoring the Shutter Speed, it is likely that the camera will drop to a longer Shutter Speed than that which is necessary to arrest Subject Motion.

(I don’t know your Flash Unit) - BUT IF your Flash Unit does NOT communicate with the 6D that there is a Flash Unit active, then you also run the risk in AV Mode of the Camera selecting a shorter shutter speed than the maximum flash sync.

I would not use P Mode (Program Mode) for this application.

*

The bottom line consideration is that, as well as riding the Power of the Flash and the Flash DISTANCE for the Flash Exposure Component; you will be (should be) riding the Shutter Speed to control the AMBIENT Exposure Component.

Both these EXPOSURES will have to be addressed AFTER you choose the APERTURE for the DoF that you require.

And as a precursor to your choice of APERTURE, you must choose an ISO to allow for an appropriate RANGE of APERTURES to be at your disposal.

Considering that I would be working with Manual Flash - all the CAMERA choices I would prefer to also be MANUAL: but that’s only how I would work and how it would work best for me.

***

* what would my best lens be for the 6d? my 24-105mm probably gives me the best quality, followed by my 85mm. If I had my 85mm on my 550d it would end up as 100mm ish with the crop factor. Although I have more than two lenses, I'd like to be able to get away with just using these two for ease & to keep things simple

Of the choice of lenses that you have I would use the 24 to 105 on the 6D. HOWEVER IF you have the kit lens (18 to 55) I would take it with you as 24mm is not all that wide on an APS-C Camera for a Wedding Shoot, especially considering that you mention ‘indoors’. Also you have NO BACK-UP for the main working lens - an 18 to 55 will provide that backup. (the 50/1.8 is NOT a back-up lens for indoor work on an APS-C Camera)

I would use the 50/1.8 on the other camera. An 85 is generally too long on an APS-C Camera to be effective as an all-round Prime to “keep it simple”.

***

* are there any general tips for using a manual flash to remove the trial & error I mentioned earlier?

Yes. Know the Distance/Power/Aperture tables by rote.
Keep a cheat-sheet on your person - preferably attached to your camera.

***

Also, in AV mode my camera has three flash shooting speeds, auto, fixed (1/180) & one with a lower/upper limit 1/60-1/180). I would assume auto is not recommended & that fixed at 1/180 would offer more consistent results, but what are the thoughts between that & the 1/60-1/180 mode?

Again I point to the fact that you need to confirm that the Flash Unit that you have, does communicate to the 6D that a Flash is active. If there is not that communication between your Flash and the Camera then you will NOT have the choices of ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’.

Also, I again point to the fact that you will (should) be riding the SHUTTER SPEED to address the AMBIENT EXPOSURE of any shot: so realistically to do that, the only choice that you have is to allow all the shutter speeds from 30s to 1/180s to be available to you.

***

The wedding is in two months, it'll be mainly be indoors due to the british weather, I'm yet to visit the venue but intend to within the next few weeks

Good idea to reconnoitre.

***

I feel I'm reasonablykitted out & am not looking to change any of my gear prior to the wedding having changed some of my gear already over the past year. I have made a bit of money selling images via getty & other stock sites but this is the first time I've had someone come to me to ask me to take images for payment. He's also a close friend who I work with - I'm therefore looking to eliminate any silly mistakes & do my best for him. . .

and

. . . My assistant will be more physical support for me, holding the flash off camera, changing batteries etc only. We're both there as guests but her job will be to help me and not take pictures.

I think that you really do need to get the relationship between you and your friend (the Bridegroom) crystal clear.

You cannot be a guest and also a paid contractor.

If you are being paid, then I suggest that you have adequate Insurances and also a Contract.

I also point to the fact that you imply you only have ONE flash Unit: it would be a mistake to go in to this paid work underequipped - in fact it is a recipe for potential business suicide, even in Great Britain.

And it would be inconsiderate and unprofessional of me, not to alert you to these basic facts.

WW

[Colin Southern]

To be honest Jason, all things considered (from what you've told us), I'd say "just don't do it". If you're doing it for money then you need to deliver a professional result -- in what is arguably the toughest environment to work in.

You need to be an expert in low-light technique - harsh-light technique - people management - all under extreme time pressure; all of that is hard enough at the best of time, but when you add additional "pucker factors" of never having done it before and having inadequate flash equipment, then it's likely to be a case of "jumping in the deep end and sinking like a stone".

Keep in mind that the B&G will have little idea as to any of these things either -- and will probably be thinking "Why spend $2500 on a professional when my mate Jason can do it for a couple of hundred; can't be hard since all you need to do with modern cameras is point them in the right direction and press the button. And heck, if they're not perfect they can just be fixed in Photoshop".

I've got my own studio - over $100k worth of gear - I shoot commercially - I even provide technical advice on occasions to other full time professional photographers ... and I still wouldn't touch a wedding with a barge pole. I just don't need that much stress in my life.

Apologies if it's not what you're wanting to hear. I'd suggest shooting a few weddings as a 2nd shooter first, and go from there.

[wellsie82]

I see more mistakes likely if you use Av Mode (Aperture Priority), because if you are distracted and NOT always monitoring the Shutter Speed, it is likely that the camera will drop to a longer Shutter Speed than that which is necessary to arrest Subject Motion.

(I don’t know your Flash Unit) - BUT IF your Flash Unit does NOT communicate with the 6D that there is a Flash Unit active, then you also run the risk in AV Mode of the Camera selecting a shorter shutter speed than the maximum flash sync.

I would not use P Mode (Program Mode) for this application.

*

The bottom line consideration is that, as well as riding the Power of the Flash and the Flash DISTANCE for the Flash Exposure Component; you will be (should be) riding the Shutter Speed to control the AMBIENT Exposure Component.

Both these EXPOSURES will have to be addressed AFTER you choose the APERTURE for the DoF that you require.

And as a precursor to your choice of APERTURE, you must choose an ISO to allow for an appropriate RANGE of APERTURES to be at your disposal.

Considering that I would be working with Manual Flash - all the CAMERA choices I would prefer to also be MANUAL: but that’s only how I would work and how it would work best for me.

thanks, these are very useful comments

Of the choice of lenses that you have I would use the 24 to 105 on the 6D. HOWEVER IF you have the kit lens (18 to 55) I would take it with you as 24mm is not all that wide on an APS-C Camera for a Wedding Shoot, especially considering that you mention ‘indoors’. Also you have NO BACK-UP for the main working lens - an 18 to 55 will provide that backup. (the 50/1.8 is NOT a back-up lens for indoor work on an APS-C Camera)

I would use the 50/1.8 on the other camera. An 85 is generally too long on an APS-C Camera to be effective as an all-round Prime to “keep it simple”.

my bad, i also have a sigma 17-70mm f2.8 which, i had been looking to offload as it vignettes horribly on the 6d, however there's no reason why i cannot keep that back to use as backup on the 550d

Yes. Know the Distance/Power/Aperture tables by rote.
Keep a cheat-sheet on your person - preferably attached to your camera.

great advice

Again I point to the fact that you need to confirm that the Flash Unit that you have, does communicate to the 6D that a Flash is active. If there is not that communication between your Flash and the Camera then you will NOT have the choices of ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’.

Also, I again point to the fact that you will (should) be riding the SHUTTER SPEED to address the AMBIENT EXPOSURE of any shot: so realistically to do that, the only choice that you have is to allow all the shutter speeds from 30s to 1/180s to be available to you.

not following the first para, ive tested that the di622 mk2 flash & the 6d work together, i suspect you meant something else though

shutter priority sounds the way to go by the sounds of things, to expose for what light there is & there introduce the flash to fill/freeze anything. i'll need to play with that auto setting (on the flash speed) when im in shutter mode & test the outcomes

I think that you really do need to get the relationship between you and your friend (the Bridegroom) crystal clear.

You cannot be a guest and also a paid contractor.

If you are being paid, then I suggest that you have adequate Insurances and also a Contract.

I also point to the fact that you imply you only have ONE flash Unit: it would be a mistake to go in to this paid work underequipped - in fact it is a recipe for potential business suicide, even in Great Britain.

And it would be inconsiderate and unprofessional of me, not to alert you to these basic facts.

this is something which i fear might be too late - i would of been attending the event as a guest anyway, however i think the groom is of the opinion that because i can get good shots in general be it aviation, travel, night time, he assumes a wedding will be a piece of cake. he is very relaxed about it all & has said a number of times im there simply to capture people enjoying themselves. i intend to do this, but i know i need to produce more than this. the fact that ive had to ask him for a list rather than him telling me what he wants from me is what im working with

i appreciate your feedback on this area (all areas for that matter!)

[wellsie82]

To be honest Jason, all things considered (from what you've told us), I'd say "just don't do it". If you're doing it for money then you need to deliver a professional result -- in what is arguably the toughest environment to work in.

You need to be an expert in low-light technique - harsh-light technique - people management - all under extreme time pressure; all of that is hard enough at the best of time, but when you add additional "pucker factors" of never having done it before and having inadequate flash equipment, then it's likely to be a case of "jumping in the deep end and sinking like a stone".

Keep in mind that the B&G will have little idea as to any of these things either -- and will probably be thinking "Why spend $2500 on a professional when my mate Jason can do it for a couple of hundred; can't be hard since all you need to do with modern cameras is point them in the right direction and press the button. And heck, if they're not perfect they can just be fixed in Photoshop".

I've got my own studio - over $100k worth of gear - I shoot commercially - I even provide technical advice on occasions to other full time professional photographers ... and I still wouldn't touch a wedding with a barge pole. I just don't need that much stress in my life.

Apologies if it's not what you're wanting to hear. I'd suggest shooting a few weddings as a 2nd shooter first, and go from there.

thanks colin, as ive just said in another reply to WW he's very laid back about the whole thing which is not what i was expecting. the more i talk to him, the more i think he wants "someone" to be there to document as much as possible. he knows ive got reservations & has repeatedly told me not to worry

he knows i'll give it my best shot & when i meet him & his partner at the venue i'll have similar conversations to ensure that she too is aware that things can & might go wrong such as me screwing up, down to gear not working or breaking down

i have scope over the next month to shoot at two family parties (both at night indoors) so this will help towards some last minute practice and/or experimentation. i may also have a chance of being a 2nd shooter at a wedding a week before the one im doing too

i respect all the advice from everyone on this thread because so many have been there & done it, however i dont feel i can let my friend down at this late stage

Hi Jason,

A lot has been written here in the past about what you're intending -- so you might find this search useful ...

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/fo...earchid=708980

In addition to that, I'd suggest popping along to www.kelbytraining.com - sign up - and go through all the lessons from David Ziser.

thanks for the reply - can you remember what you were searching for as the url isn't working for me

[Colin Southern]

thanks colin, as ive just said in another reply to WW he's very laid back about the whole thing which is not what i was expecting. the more i talk to him, the more i think he wants "someone" to be there to document as much as possible. he knows ive got reservations & has repeatedly told me not to worry

he knows i'll give it my best shot & when i meet him & his partner at the venue i'll have similar conversations to ensure that she too is aware that things can & might go wrong such as me screwing up, down to gear not working or breaking down

i have scope over the next month to shoot at two family parties (both at night indoors) so this will help towards some last minute practice and/or experimentation. i may also have a chance of being a 2nd shooter at a wedding a week before the one im doing too

i respect all the advice from everyone on this thread because so many have been there & done it, however i dont feel i can let my friend down at this late stage



thanks for the reply - can you remember what you were searching for as the url isn't working for me

Hi Jason,

Hmmm - not sure why the search doesn't work (it's not working for me either now, although I did test it at the time!). Try this:

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/fo...?search_type=1

Just type "weddings" into the tags field.

It's hard to visualise what the groom's mindset is; in most cases if the groom is responsible for organising the photography and the results aren't spectacular then it could well be a very short marriage! It's almost like he has visions of you attending as a guest - share a joke - take a few shots - enjoy a drink - take a few more shots etc whereas in reality to document the event professionally it's more like "mach 2 with your hair on fire" for the entire day. So something isn't adding up there; I'd recommend getting to the bottom of it before it's too late. To me it seems in-congruent that he's about to celebrate a union that (supposedly!) is to last the rest of their natural lives - is the biggest day of their lives - and he's casual about leaving the official record of that to a guest with a camera??? Whaaat???

[Shadowman]

Hi Jason,

Hmmm - not sure why the search doesn't work (it's not working for me either now, although I did test it at the time!). Try this:

https://www.cambridgeincolour.com/fo...?search_type=1

Just type "weddings" into the tags field.

It's hard to visualise what the groom's mindset is; in most cases if the groom is responsible for organising the photography and the results aren't spectacular then it could well be a very short marriage! It's almost like he has visions of you attending as a guest - share a joke - take a few shots - enjoy a drink - take a few more shots etc whereas in reality to document the event professionally it's more like "mach 2 with your hair on fire" for the entire day. So something isn't adding up there; I'd recommend getting to the bottom of it before it's too late. To me it seems in-congruent that he's about to celebrate a union that (supposedly!) is to last the rest of their natural lives - is the biggest day of their lives - and he's casual about leaving the official record of that to a guest with a camera??? Whaaat???

Also, the bride and groom are only a small part of this festivity. There is also the mother of the bride and groom who perhaps has to be appeased.

[Digital]

Jason, although it has been a long time since I have done a wedding it was always my practice to meet with the bride, and groom in person prior to the wedding for a SERIOUS discussion of what type of photography they wanted at the wedding. I always attended the rehearsal as well.
For me this was one way to avoid a lot of problems.
I am with Colin - I would not do a wedding at this time. I am getting to old.


Bruce

[Colin Southern]

Jason,

You might find the free "books" from veteran wedding photographer Al Jacobs valuable (I like his sense of humour)

http://www.aljacobs.com/the-wedding/

[The Blue Boy]

Jason,

this is the best advice so far...

Apologies if it's not what you're wanting to hear. I'd suggest shooting a few weddings as a 2nd shooter first, and go from there.

As usual Colin shoots straight from the hip (so to speak... )

By doing the above you'll learn just how difficult these bloody events really are. I've done a few in the past and can honestly say that I enjoyed none of them.

[William W]

Of the choice of lenses that you have I would use the 24 to 105 on the 6D. HOWEVER IF you have the kit lens (18 to 55) I would take it with you as 24mm is not all that wide on an APS-C Camera for a Wedding Shoot . . .

my bad, i also have a sigma 17-70mm f2.8 which, i had been looking to offload as it vignettes horribly on the 6d, however there's no reason why i cannot keep that back to use as backup on the 550d

Thanks. Understood.

I would take the 17 to 70/2.8.

You probably know this – but anyway: That particular Sigma Lens is “designed” to work (only) on a Canon APS-C Camera (i.e. it throws an APS-C sized Image Circle).

However, it has a Canon “EF” Lens Mount. This is a point worthy of note about third party lenses designed for use on Canon APS-C Cameras: that is - unlike the Canon EF-S Lenses, third party lenses from Tokina, Sigma and Tamron all have a Canon ‘EF’ Bayonet Mount, which means that they can be mounted and used on all canon EOS Cameras. Therefore (taking your situation as an example) in a emergency you could use the 17 to 70/2.8 on the 6D.

Just something for you to think about: now that I know that you have a fast zoom for the 550D and an IS zoom for the 6D, I probably would just use the two zoom lenses and take the 50/1.8 as the third tier backup.

I’ve used the 24 to 105/4L on a 5D and pumped out good to very good 10x8 print quality at ISO “H” (aka 3200) – so I would be happy as a bat in a cave in low light and shooting sans flash with a 6D’s sensor. I’d keep the 50/1.8 in my pocket and pull it out only if the environ was so dark to make F/4 too slow for an ‘appropriate’ ISO choice.

I’d just use the Flash on the 550D and 17 to 70/2.8 rig or use the flash off camera held by your assistant – though I do think off camera flash is a big ask, if you want to “keep it simple.”

I’d work with two cameras slung on me.

The idea of working two cameras might be too much to consider on your first date, but that set up is worth mentioning to you, especially if you are reasonably competent in Available Light with your 6D and the 24 to 105/4L IS Lens.


***

not following the first para, ive tested that the di622 mk2 flash & the 6d work together, i suspect you meant something else though

OK.
Follows is an explanation of what you did not understand.

You asked:

. . . Also, in AV mode my camera has three flash shooting speeds, auto, fixed (1/180) & one with a lower/upper limit 1/60-1/180). I would assume auto is not recommended & that fixed at 1/180 would offer more consistent results, but what are the thoughts between that & the 1/60-1/180 mode?

I answered:

Again I point to the fact that you need to confirm that the Flash Unit that you have, does communicate to the 6D that a Flash is active. If there is not that communication between your Flash and the Camera then you will NOT have the choices of ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’.

Also, I again point to the fact that you will (should) be riding the SHUTTER SPEED to address the AMBIENT EXPOSURE of any shot: so realistically to do that, the only choice that you have is to allow all the shutter speeds from 30s to 1/180s to be available to you.

The first paragraph in my answer is referring to the options that you have to control the selection the shutter speed when the camera is in Av Mode and a Flash is Active.

The NAME of that functionality is ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’ and you access that functionality and choose the setting that you want, via the camera’s menu system

However, that functionality will NOT be available to you unless the camera RECOGNIZES that a Flash is ACTIVE on the Hot-shoe. Most probably, if the flash fires: then the camera does recognize that there is a flash active – BUT I WOULD NOT BET A MARS BAR ON IT.

Testing the Flash only confirms that the Flash Fires and does NOT confirm that the ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’ is working correctly.


What I would do is TEST the functionality (of ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’) in ALL THREE of the options - with the flash on the Hot-shoe and turned on and CONFIRM that the camera is limiting the shutter speeds as you expect it so to do in each of those three selections.

Of course if you choose not to use Av Mode with the Nissan Flash, then doing such a test is irrelevant: I was only alerting you to pitfalls – for example IF you think that you have limited the shutter speed to a certain range and in fact you have not – then you might have a few surprises.


***

The points made about the expectations of the Bride and the Mother of the Bride irrespective of what your understanding is with the Groom, are all, most relevant.


I wish you good luck with it.


WW

[Colin Southern]

Plan B2(ii) ... could you rent / beg / borrow something like a 580EX II or 600EX-RT flash for the day?

[William W]

Plan B2(ii) ... could you rent / beg / borrow something like a 580EX II or 600EX-RT flash for the day?

Good idea.

And use the 6D and 24 to 105/4 for everything.

P Mode / On Camera Bounce Card Flash / ISO 800 will be your friends if you get in any fast moving pace where you cannot think quickly.



WW


PS
I will now celebrate your suggestion and have a NZ White as it is very over hot here.
CU all later, Happy New Year.

[wellsie82]

Thanks. Understood.

I would take the 17 to 70/2.8.

You probably know this – but anyway: That particular Sigma Lens is “designed” to work (only) on a Canon APS-C Camera (i.e. it throws an APS-C sized Image Circle).

However, it has a Canon “EF” Lens Mount. This is a point worthy of note about third party lenses designed for use on Canon APS-C Cameras: that is - unlike the Canon EF-S Lenses, third party lenses from Tokina, Sigma and Tamron all have a Canon ‘EF’ Bayonet Mount, which means that they can be mounted and used on all canon EOS Cameras. Therefore (taking your situation as an example) in a emergency you could use the 17 to 70/2.8 on the 6D.

Just something for you to think about: now that I know that you have a fast zoom for the 550D and an IS zoom for the 6D, I probably would just use the two zoom lenses and take the 50/1.8 as the third tier backup.

I’ve used the 24 to 105/4L on a 5D and pumped out good to very good 10x8 print quality at ISO “H” (aka 3200) – so I would be happy as a bat in a cave in low light and shooting sans flash with a 6D’s sensor. I’d keep the 50/1.8 in my pocket and pull it out only if the environ was so dark to make F/4 too slow for an ‘appropriate’ ISO choice.

I’d just use the Flash on the 550D and 17 to 70/2.8 rig or use the flash off camera held by your assistant – though I do think off camera flash is a big ask, if you want to “keep it simple.”

I’d work with two cameras slung on me.

The idea of working two cameras might be too much to consider on your first date, but that set up is worth mentioning to you, especially if you are reasonably competent in Available Light with your 6D and the 24 to 105/4L IS Lens.


***




OK.
Follows is an explanation of what you did not understand.

You asked:


I answered:


The first paragraph in my answer is referring to the options that you have to control the selection the shutter speed when the camera is in Av Mode and a Flash is Active.

The NAME of that functionality is ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’ and you access that functionality and choose the setting that you want, via the camera’s menu system

However, that functionality will NOT be available to you unless the camera RECOGNIZES that a Flash is ACTIVE on the Hot-shoe. Most probably, if the flash fires: then the camera does recognize that there is a flash active – BUT I WOULD NOT BET A MARS BAR ON IT.

Testing the Flash only confirms that the Flash Fires and does NOT confirm that the ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’ is working correctly.


What I would do is TEST the functionality (of ‘Flash Synchronization in Av Mode’) in ALL THREE of the options - with the flash on the Hot-shoe and turned on and CONFIRM that the camera is limiting the shutter speeds as you expect it so to do in each of those three selections.

Of course if you choose not to use Av Mode with the Nissan Flash, then doing such a test is irrelevant: I was only alerting you to pitfalls – for example IF you think that you have limited the shutter speed to a certain range and in fact you have not – then you might have a few surprises.


***

The points made about the expectations of the Bride and the Mother of the Bride irrespective of what your understanding is with the Groom, are all, most relevant.


I wish you good luck with it.


WW

William - thank you - this is all invaluable advice.

Keeping it simple is a must and what you've said there in terms of the 24-105mm on the 6d without the flash makes sense. It also helps to skirt around another potential issue ive come across yesterday in that in AV or SP modes on the 6d (and 550d for that matter), the max iso is 400 which probably wouldn't be high enough (depending on ambient light levels of course).

I wasn't aware that the sigma 17-70 was only designed for the crop sensored models as it did "work" on my 6d when i first got it & tested it - that would help to explain why that horrid circle appears around it. Whilst I've got it, it makes sense to pop it onto the 550d.

As the back-up, it makes sense that you earlier mentioned the 50 f1.8 rather than the 85 f1.8 - assume this is because at the wedding you're after more than head/head&shoulders because of the details, the dresses & capturing the moments

Plan B2(ii) ... could you rent / beg / borrow something like a 580EX II or 600EX-RT flash for the day?

i could, but they know what gear i have & im reluctant to obtain additional gear, essentially because of the cost & lack of time to learn it & test it

ive emailed the groom asking to meet both him and his partner asap to firm up what they want. i feel that the originally remit of "take pics of people enjoying themselves" will be replaced with something a bit more structured so when i know what they want, i can go from there & look at poses/locations at the venue

summing it though, it sounds like this is what's being suggested:-

6d with 24-105mm

550d with 17-70mm + flash

i do have back problems (i know, i know), so if i did have to give the 550d to my partner to help me & i kept the 6d, what set-up would you suggest on the 550d? flash on the hotshoe/camera or perhaps on that bracket i mentioned to the side of the camera?

also, is there any reason why on the 6d i can't dial in an auto iso of 125-3200 in AV mode & then go f4-5.6 in the couple/individual shots & a higher f number on the group shots?