How to get started

[TobyMac]

Hello all,
So in the past I have mainly been doing photography as a hobby, although I did study it the last two years, which doesn't really means anything, I plan to turn it into a business and do it professionally full time.

So my question is this to those that already do it as a business, how did you get started, how did you get into the industry and what are some tips or tricks to get a business started?

As a side note, I do mostly food, however I enjoy my wildlife and particularly macro photography, but I don't really see how to make money from that other than selling prints maybe.

Any advise, hints, tips or tricks and even past experiences would be much appreciated.

[Manfred M]

Hello all,
So in the past I have mainly been doing photography as a hobby, although I did study it the last two years, which doesn't really means anything, I plan to turn it into a business and do it professionally full time.

So my question is this to those that already do it as a business, how did you get started, how did you get into the industry and what are some tips or tricks to get a business started?

As a side note, I do mostly food, however I enjoy my wildlife and particularly macro photography, but I don't really see how to make money from that other than selling prints maybe.

Any advise, hints, tips or tricks and even past experiences would be much appreciated.

It is a tough business to break into, as there is lots of competition; I think one of the first things to figure out is what kind of photography you want to do and if there is a market niche that you can serve. I know a number of professional photographers, and with the exception of one husband and wife team who do wedding and portraiture work, all the others have gotten into other lines of work (including teaching) as they cannot make a go of it any more. I know one that is making a fairly decent bit of money photographing horses a horse shows and selling prints to participants (this is to supplement his retirement income). I've met another who travels to car shows and does similar work.

A good place to start might be Kirk Tuck's "Commerical Photography Handbook", as that will answer some of the questions that you have.

[shreds]

Get in with an existing photographer, offer to be dogsbody, tea boy and second shooter. Might even need to be for no remuneration at first.

You are going to need huge determination and self confidence to carry you through the knock backs, together with a certain amount of 'fall back' income. As Manfred says, find a niche, talk to people, talk more, and offer your services. It is not an easy path and the kit is going to set you back although you don't need it all at once. May be try partnering with a couple of other guys and share equipment.

Plus you need a boatload of luck to be in the right place at the right time talking to or shooting the right people/products.

..........and you shoot what the client wants, not necessarily what you want, but if they are paying you good money, so what!

Difficult to summarise quickly but read around the subject, and be persistent.

[Manfred M]

Just to add one more (scary) thought.

I took a studio lighting course at the local community college about three years ago, and there were about 25 people in the class. There were two of us that were taking the course out of interest (me and one other). The rest of the class was made up of people who wanted to get into the business; students looking to get into photography as a career, housewives looking to make a bit of money on the side, retirees looking to supplement their pensions and several people who wanted a career change.

Just about anyone with a camera seems to consider himself or herself a photographer these days. Virtually none had any business sense or any idea as how to price their work, and the ones that told me what they were selling their work for would have made more money flipping burgers at a fast food restaurant.

The two of us who were there purely out of interest, have well paid professional careers and had better photographic skills (and equipment) than the people trying to get into the business. I'm and engineering manager and the other was an anethatist at one of the local hospitals.

[rpcrowe]

FIRST and foremost. A photographer needs to have the photo skills which will enable him or her to compete.

IMO, the business side of photography is probably the most important factor (given reasonable photographic skill) and probably the factor (among photographers who have the requisite photo skills) for photography businesses failing...

An old comedy quip, usually directed at a person trying to sing, is "Don't quit your day job!" I would expect that this is a viable piece of advice to the neophyte professional photographer.

Finally, there is not a great market for the "artsy-craftsy" type of photography that is so much fun to do. Unfortunately, many community college courses are aimed at this type of photography and the results are best to hang on coffee shop walls while the graduates wait on tables.

What is the best way to make money, I don't really know. But, I do strongly believe that a portfolio of commercially viable images is a prerequisite to any professional venture. I occasionally shoot with a group that concentrates on fashion and portrait photography. Occasionally, they hold seminars on portfolio development. If I were needing a portfolio, I would seek out this type of help...

Here's an addendum:

These days, virtually anyone who owns a DSLR camera has equipment which could possibly produce very good to excellent images that can be enlarged at least to 8x10 inches. Whether the photographer has equivalent capability is certainly a different subject. However, the person who wants to become a professional photographer these days has a lot of competition from the multitude of DSLR owners. Uncle Joe could shoot the wedding free of charge and Aunt Sally could do the family portraits with no pay. Whether or not Uncle Joe or Aunt Sally can produce professional quality images, they are still competition.

Contrast this to the Dark Ages of film when Uncle Joe and Aunt Sally were shooting with Box Brownie and Instamatic type cameras. These cameras could never produce even close to professional quality results; so the person who owned a Rolleiflex or even a Yashicamat was head and shoulders above the competition at the start.

This is true in other fields of photography also. How many times have we seen posts in which a company has elected a salesperson or clerk, who happens to own a DSLR, to do their advertising photography? That is the competition that the aspiring professional photographer faces.

The professional photographer of today must, first, be a very good photographer and, secondly, know how to market his or her talents and skills so that the customer will choose the professional rather than ask Uncle Joe or Aunt Sally to shoot the wedding or the family portrait.

[William W]

. . . I plan to turn it [photography] into a business and do it professionally full time. . . So my question is this to those that already do it as a business, how did you get started, how did you get into the industry and what are some tips or tricks to get a business started? . . . Any advise, hints, tips or tricks and even past experiences would be much appreciated.

I started shooting for a Wedding Studio when I was a Student doing my Dip Photog.

At the same time I also shot "on speculation" for newspapers, journals, magazines, record companies . . . - virtually any editor who would receive a submission.

If I learned anything from those two years of frenetic shooting, developing and printing it was -

stop: think; plan; and TARGET.

*

In your profile you write: "About TobyMac
Biography: Professional food and lifestyle photographer, eager to learn and expand."

So one basic step would be to dissect what jobs that you have already done and look at where they worked and where you could have done better (that's not 'better photo', that's 'better business outcome') and find out the "why" for each.

WW

[TobyMac]

Thank you all, I know it's going to be an uphill battle but I think my passion for this will pull me through somehow.
@Richard, the whole "everyone with a DSLR can be a photographer" bit really irritates me at times actually. I love the advancements that digital has made but it is also hurting the professionals.
@Bill, didn't you figure out what to target by doing all the other work before?

[William W]

@Bill, didn't you figure out what to target by doing all the other work before?

Yes, I did: that was the point I was making - it took me two years of a shotgun approach to business, to work out what I should target in my business ventures.

So, as a response to my second comment: what jobs that you have done, have you dissected so far?

WW

[TobyMac]

Well as I said it has mainly been family portraits and portraits in general that I have been shooting, and although I did enjoy it I don't enjoy it as much as shooting food. As far as food goes I haven't actually had any jobs because I don't really know where to start.

[Manfred M]

Reminds me of a similar situation regarding another hobby of mine.

The former owner of the scuba diving shop I deal with got into running a dive shop the same way. Loved scuba as a hobby and decided to get into the business. Needless to say, he does not dive as a hobby any more and found that the love of diving and running a business were almost complete opposites.

I think that you will find the same thing if you try to get into the photography business; while interest in photography and associated skills are a starting point, the business side is (getting the clients and taking care of the business aspects are going to consume at least 90% of your time). At least that is what the successful professional photographers I know (and I do know a few fairly well) tell me. Being a good small businessman is far more important than being a good photographer.

[TobyMac]

I see your point and it makes sense, I guess I'll just have to power through that part of it if I want to become successful

[William W]

Well as I said it has mainly been family portraits and portraits in general that I have been shooting, and although I did enjoy it I don't enjoy it as much as shooting food. As far as food goes I haven't actually had any jobs because I don't really know where to start.

OK. Thanks for answering.

I'll make a couple of points and I trust that you will take them on board as constructive advice, for getting your business started.

Firstly you need to be precise in what you do and in what you say: for example I can't see anywhere "as I said it has mainly been family portraits and portraits in general that I have been shooting . . ."
One main reason why you need to be precise, is because that allows YOU clarity of thought and if you are clear in your thoughts then you will have a better idea of what you want to do and the outcomes that you expect and thus be better prepared to examine those outcomes.

Secondly, in business: you should never purport to be what you are not nor should you promise what you cannot reasonably and honestly expect to deliver. For example I noted in my first response that in your Bio you stated that you ARE a professional photographer. Therefore, in responding to your question about building your business to ‘full time’, I had a reasonable expectation that you had already done jobs which we could discuss and that is why I constructed my answer the way I did.
For me (as your ‘customer’) I expected that we could discuss some of the jobs which you have already done and what portions of those jobs did not meet your expectations. I expected this conversation because of the promise that you made to me that you were already shooting ‘food and lifestyle’ professionally.
So as your ‘customer’ it would be easy for me to be let down and feel as though I have wasted some of my valuable time.

***

So now that those points are made and I have a better outline of your position, I make the following suggestions (additional to those two above):

1. I think that it is poor business judgement to PLAN a business upon ONLY a small niche of what YOU like doing. It would be better to survey your MARKET PLACE to investigate what areas of Photography can offer you a reasonable return on your investment of Time and Capital.

*

2. Your ‘Market Place’ might appear to be global because you think that you can sell online, but consider the time and capital that you will need to get prospects to look on line at your work: and then consider how you will have the initial sales conversation with those prospects.

As a rule of thumb I think that most strong Photography Businesses, still begin within their local geography and as a result of human, face to face interaction.

*

3. Think laterally – ALL the time.

As just one very tiny example and considering your position as you have outlined:

As far as food goes I haven't actually had any jobs because I don't really know where to start.

Maybe there is a local requirement for your work, I don’t know, but I would try it out if I were you . . .

I just searched “Johannesburg Food Markets” and in the first hit there are eight market places open this Saturday and Sunday. Also there is a link to the “Cape Town Carnival” and also a space asking for “Advertise your market here and standout”.

So, if I were you and if I were hungry to get my professional photography business going 'full time', I would be testing the waters this weekend and shooting pro bono at those food markets ALL THIS WEEKEND.

Additionally, I would be in touch with those web advertisers and investigating the rates and I would be planning how to present a finished package for web display to several of the market vendors, next weekend.

Even if you don’t sell anything – you have gained a truckload of experience will have made several mistakes and have begun your portfolio of "Food Photography".

Also next week, you might supply a precise debrief on this thread, which we may then discuss.

Good luck with your tasks this coming week.

WW

[nimitzbenedicto]

How to get started?

My friend( and his wife) were/are photo-enthusiast/hobbyists. Then started shooting events pro bono ( just as Bill advised) , then, networking via family, friends, internet/on-line and hands-on/moral support from our photo club. ( He always invites and our members always obliged to assist him on his paid shoots)

2yrs later, he is now well-established events photo group.
But still loves to go out and just shoot ( anything) on their free days.

He started with a Nikon D3000, now he has a couple of full-frame cams along with quality lens/lights/editing software/etc.

and, yes, he has a "day-job".

https://www.facebook.com/iLaWoDigitalServices

HTH

[Mike Buckley]

@Richard, the whole "everyone with a DSLR can be a photographer" bit really irritates me at times actually. I love the advancements that digital has made but it is also hurting the professionals.

To be frank, I think you need to change your attitude about that to be a successful professional. Starting a business that irritates you because of increased competition and changing attitudes and needs of prospective clients is tantamount to starting a doomed business.

Instead, start your business as a solution to the pain that prospective clients are experiencing. Identify that pain, determine how to market your solution, provide the solution and sell it.

Once you've begun doing all of that, always think at least three years in advance about what the next pain will be that is looking for a solution. Otherwise, the industry will have changed and left you being irritated as you are now.

[dabhand]

I've got to second all Mike said.

Being in business is all about supplying what the customer needs - not what you want or feel they should have, too many (and generally unsuccessful ) photographers / businesses take the 'it's my way or no way' approach.

The hard part is understanding what the customer needs as opposed to wants; ask any farmer back in the day and they wanted more horses, better carts and cheaper labourers - what they really needed was machinery and less of all the other stuff and why tractors were successful !

Creating the foundations of a successful business takes a great deal of time and effort as others above have shown and being able to take technically perfect images is no guarantee - current trends within the general population (your market) is away from that kind of image - are you confident there will be a viable market in the future and that you will be able to access it, for whatever direction you aim to go ?

And that's where Mike's three year outlook/plan really comes in without one you risk wasting your time, effort and money in a business that is doomed to fail.

steve

[Saorsa]

There are a lot of different ways to make money in photography. None of them are worth more than a good idea unless you are willing to spend the time and effort to run a business as well as take care of art and skills of the craft.

A lot of excellent mechanics work for garage owners because they don't do well running a business. The skill sets don't match up.

If you are only looking for money to pay for your hobby, you need to plan around your day job.

That is the way I have worked on a lot of things. For a while, I lived in a scenic area of the UK on a military base. I had a lot of good touristy shots of the area and knew the local beauty spots. I was out with friends one day and took a couple of family photos in the park. They liked them and I just gave them the negative to use for their Christmas Card photo for friends back in the US. But, the next summer, I started getting requests from folks to take their family photos for the same purpose next year.

Over the first year I bought and paid off a lot of gear, Nikon F2, lenses from 24m to a 500mm reflex. But, after a while I was bored. I was taking the same picture over and over. The people were different but the shot was the same. It was dull and boring. So, I found another fellow who wanted more gear and basically referred everyone to him.

A few years later, I'm into digital, the old gear funded some of the new but I wanted a bit more. I looked around and found a bit of work shooting amateur equestrian events. The same cycle occured and I dropped out of that.

I don't want my photography to be a business or take over my life. I like it as a hobby, compete in a few competitions and enjoy it.

If something new comes along that I "MUST HAVE" but can't afford maybe I'll find another opportunity. There are plenty of them out there.

[jcuknz]

Some forty five years ago when I was taking photographs for a living my fellow workers when we talked about our work thought there were three times as many photographers for the work available.

Fortunately for me I had my 'love' which was film and with TV recently arrived in NZ I got a job doing 'my thing', I was very lucky that twelve years of training myself had paid off.

Subsequently photography schools have proliferated, in my day there were just two in the UK, likewise in the States, and they churn out graduates with certificates every year .... then the automatic camera arrived, first with film and later with digital and such gear turns everybody into a 'professional'

I wish you well becuase a few are succeeding despite the environment and I hope you are one of them ... but as written above "Don't give up your day job".

[TobyMac]

@Bill, thanks for the great feedback! I guess it was ignorance on my part because I assumed that to bee seen as a professional I need to label myself as a professional, but I definitely see your point and I have taken it into consideration and changed my Profile Bio.

I picked to focus my efforts onto food photography because I was told by a well established local photographer that there aren't many in the Johannesburg area. I told him I planned to give food photography a skip and try find something with better pay but he managed to convince me otherwise so I assume there must be some sort of opportunity here.

As for the food markets, thats a brilliant idea and I kick myself for not thinking of that and I am making a plan to go to those next weekend as I didn't have time this weekend.

A little something that keeps coming up when I speak to others is the idea of working for free. Some say it needs to be done to get established and others say to never do anything for free, so I am slightly on the fence about this. I had a plan to approach up and coming restaurants that don't yet have a budget for fancy photos and asking if I can shoot their food for my portfolio, all I would ask in return is for them to credit me for the work and allow me to use the photos.

@Mike, maybe irritation is the wrong word but I just find it a bit sad that I work so hard to come up with the perfect image, thinking about all the details and setting and spending so much time and effort on it yet anyone with a camera set to Auto can achieve something just as acceptable without much effort. I know I shouldn't let it get to me and it is something I will need to wirk on.

As for "keeping my day Job", Photography is all I have, I need to make this work, I don't have anything else to fall back on.

@Steve, I agree with you that it's all about what the customer wants and not what I want and I am prepared to make that happen, it's getting the customers thats the problem at the moment. I assume it's partially also because I need to put together a proper portfolio, I used to think the images I have up on my website are fine but I see now that I will have to really work on that and create something appealing and coherent.

Thanks again to all that replied, this is really helpful stuff

[drjuice]

You might also search the website using a term like "photography business" or something similar. I make this suggestion because a number of people have received suggestions in various fora (MOSTLY not impolite!) about how to tackle this particular issue.

Good luck.

virginia

[William W]

Thank you for answering and supplying valuable information such that I might be better placed to offer assistance to you.

Addressing a few points that you have made:

. . . I assumed that to [be] seen as a professional I need to label myself as a professional, but I definitely see your point and I have taken it into consideration and changed my Profile Bio.

Very few things are black and white.

Note that I was commenting on how I could have been misinformed and consequently annoyed by the information on you Bio page – AND – your question. So there are TWO elements to my initial confusion and possible annoyance.
And then there is a third element – (me) – and the fact that I conducted research BEFORE I interacted with you to enable me to supply my best response to your question.

On the other hand:
IF you met me at a function and you introduced yourself as, “Hi I am Tobais and I am a Photographer”, I would NOT respond by saying, “WOW, what jobs have you recently done and why weren’t you happy, with the outcome?”

I think it is every IMPORTANT for you to Act and Think of yourself as a Photographer and doing so will assist you in your quest.

Also you have to act and think as a Business owner and a protector of your business if you are going to succeed.

But let’s say I did meet you at a function and after telling me that you were a Photographer and I said, “WOW – what do you Photograph” and you said “I shoot a lot of food” and I said, “WOW, are you a professional?” then you are at a point in our conversation where you have a CHOICE (and sometime ego makes the wrong choice) . . .

You could choose to say “I am really working hard on that at the moment, that is my very serious goal, but as yet I have not landed a professional engagement”

–OR-

you could say (or you could have said at the beginning of the conversation), “My name is Tobias and, yes, I am a Professional Photographer.”

***

I picked to focus my efforts onto food photography because I was told by a well established local photographer that there aren't many in the Johannesburg area. I told him I planned to give food photography a skip and try find something with better pay but he managed to convince me otherwise so I assume there must be some sort of opportunity here.

The well established Photographer may have many reasons for saying that to you. And it might be a very accurate analysis.

If I were given that advice I would then initially investigate two things: how much effort that well established photographer is putting into the under-supported and obviously big slice of profit food photography area and how much the well established business has GROWN in the last five years.

If the well established photographer is not infiltrating the supposed lucrative food photography market himself, then find out 'why' as there could be a very good reason why he does not want a piece of that pie and is suggesting it to you for totally your benefit.

Also I would ask you, how many well established business Johannesburg Photographer have you asked opinions of, because a sample of one, is not a big sample group.

***

As for the food markets, thats a brilliant idea and I kick myself for not thinking of that and I am making a plan to go to those next weekend as I didn't have time this weekend.

Thank you, but, please note It was not just one idea, shooting the shooting at the food markets: the web page advert and subsequently making a proposition with a package to the stall holders.

***

A little something that keeps coming up when I speak to others is the idea of working for free. Some say it needs to be done to get established and others say to never do anything for free, so I am slightly on the fence about this. I had a plan to approach up and coming restaurants that don't yet have a budget for fancy photos and asking if I can shoot their food for my portfolio, all I would ask in return is for them to credit me for the work and allow me to use the photos.

Well, I shoot quite a lot Pro Bono. And I always have. The stuff I shoot Pro Bono now I tend to give away to charity and people whom I choose.

BUT please re-read, very carefully the initial suggestion that I made to you about the food markets and other things – those ideas were NOT about you “shooting for free”.

Those ideas were all about you: “shooting on speculation of an instant sale”; “shooting on speculation of a later package sale”; “shooting to increase photographic skills”; “shooting to gain a portfolio”; “shooting to get experience”; shooting to get confidence”; . . . etc.

None of those ideas is about shooting for free.

***

. . . I just find it a bit sad that I work so hard to come up with the perfect image, thinking about all the details and setting and spending so much time and effort on it yet anyone with a camera set to Auto can achieve something just as acceptable without much effort.

Totally and absolutely the wrong mindset: with that mindset I will bet one Mars Bar that you will fail at the quest of making a good profitable business before you even get started.

It is all about getting the saleable image and making the sale before, the other guy.

***

I agree with you that it's all about what the customer wants and not what I want and I am prepared to make that happen, it's getting the customers thats the problem at the moment. I assume it's partially also because I need to put together a proper portfolio, I used to think the images I have up on my website are fine but I see now that I will have to really work on that and create something appealing and coherent.

The Customers won’t come to you just because you have a website or a sign outside your apartment.

Everyone whom you interact with is a Prospect.

Sure you need to have a portfolio, but more than that you need to be getting out and meeting those Prospects and thinking laterally as to how you can be shooting something – EVERYDAY – with the potential of a SALE.

***

A few check list points BEFORE you even think a about a portfolio:

1. Do you have a business card?

2. Do you have a business name and all the necessary paperwork completed and filed to conform with applicable Business Laws?

3. Do you have all the necessary paperwork completed and lodged to conform with all Tax Laws?

4. Do you have INSURANCE?

WW