reduce noise or sharpen...

[bnnrcn]

I was trying to edit a photo with W&B funtion in Photoshop CC.Everything went fine,I even added a tint to my photo and I flattened the layers .But when I resized the image for CIC it became really crispy because of the twigs and bushes around.So I'm uploading one sharpened version which is bad IMO and one version with noice reduction (I dragged the 'preserve details' slider to zero,otherwise I couldn't get rid of the crispy look ).My question is this: With sharpened version the image looks really bad,with noice reduction it looks better but it is soft.So,what is the right processing steps for a better result?


This is the sharpened one




This is the one with noice reduction (preserve details slider dragged to zero)

[saea501]

This picture just doesn't have it for me. Probably because there is no subject....I don't know where to look. Plus it's kind of busy so it makes me want to stop looking at it, which is not a quality you want in a photo.

[ajohnw]

There is so much detail in it that it's more likely to look good in a larger print. You might have noticed that on your PC screen at larger sizes.

John
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[Paniaa]

Well, perhaps not a subject in the image, but I perceive it as waiting for someone to appear. It's a bit like a Lord of the Rings pic, more so in the 2nd version; any minute now there's going to be a hobbit or an orc. I don't understand the 1st, it looks full of prickles to me. 2c?

[Shadowman]

I normally take photos like this to get a sense of depth or a 3-dimension look. There are small blades of light and if you want to get more out of this image you'll have to emphasize the lights and shadows. At different times of the day you'll achieve a sense of depth more easily. Whenever I apply noise reduction to an image it usually loses detail. Try adding grain as one method of editing or just minimize your noise reduction and then add additional contrast.

[Geoff F]

What settings are you using with your processing, Binnur?

When resizing, I avoid the auto sharpening features like BiCubic Sharpener. Because it doesn't give any personal control over how much sharpening is applied. So I end up with the same sort of effects which you are experiencing.

So, for me, it goes like this.

Do any noise supression while converting the Raw image, or before any other adjustments if not shooting Raw. Noise reduction can cause softness so I'm always wary of using too much. One alternative which I often use is to apply a little bit of Blur Brush which can be carefully applied as and where needed. But it is somewhat time consuming.

Then do my normal sharpening towards the end of processing. Watch out for increasing any noise problems while sharpening. My typical sharpen would be Unsharp Mask around 80 to 120% at 1 or 2 pixels radius at 1 to 3 threshold. But that is just my average settings and there are always exceptions.

When resizing for internet use; that is exactly what I do, a simple Image Size change, not any of the auto resize for the web etc options.

So for CinC use I would resize to 1,000 pixels on the long edge and 96 ppi. Again, this is slightly variable.

Then I might do an extra sharpen if required. Somewhere around 40 or 50% with 0.5 pixel radius and threshold 1.

Other people may do things slightly differently but the principles should be similar.

[bnnrcn]

Yes John,it looks better with the original size,but I had to resize it for web and I ended with such a result,that's why I started a thread.

There is so much detail in it that it's more likely to look good in a larger print. You might have noticed that on your PC screen at larger sizes.

John
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[bnnrcn]

Hi Pania and Bob,I uploaded this photo as a piece of learning curve,I'm new to photoshop and I'm practising.So,the composition of the image doesn't matter to me very much.My question is about PP.Thanks for commenting about composition though

[bnnrcn]

Thank you John

I normally take photos like this to get a sense of depth or a 3-dimension look. There are small blades of light and if you want to get more out of this image you'll have to emphasize the lights and shadows. At differe


nt times of the day you'll achieve a sense of depth more easily. Whenever I apply noise reduction to an image it usually loses detail. Try adding grain as one method of editing or just minimize your noise reduction and then add additional contrast.

[bnnrcn]

Thank you Geoff,the problem started first when resizing ,because there were too many small details in the image and it got a crispy look when resized.That's why I tried the noise reduction and I dragged the 'preserve details' slider to zero.So,noise reduction wasn't my intention actually but I tried to find a way to reduce the crispy look.

When resizing I used 'Image Resize' function in PS CC and I changed the dimensions.Resample box was checked already and 'automatic' was chosen already.So,no BiCubic sharpening.But I will try unchecking the Resample box and doing resizing this way for a trial.I think this is a problem with the photos include too many small details.May be it is better not to resize them because it looks better on my screen with the original dimensions.

Learning photoshop takes time and there are so many details.I will also try other options in the resample box while downsizing an image.Thanks again

What settings are you using with your processing, Binnur?

When resizing, I avoid the auto sharpening features like BiCubic Sharpener. Because it doesn't give any personal control over how much sharpening is applied. So I end up with the same sort of effects which you are experiencing.

So, for me, it goes like this.

Do any noise supression while converting the Raw image, or before any other adjustments if not shooting Raw. Noise reduction can cause softness so I'm always wary of using too much. One alternative which I often use is to apply a little bit of Blur Brush which can be carefully applied as and where needed. But it is somewhat time consuming.

Then do my normal sharpening towards the end of processing. Watch out for increasing any noise problems while sharpening. My typical sharpen would be Unsharp Mask around 80 to 120% at 1 or 2 pixels radius at 1 to 3 threshold. But that is just my average settings and there are always exceptions.

When resizing for internet use; that is exactly what I do, a simple Image Size change, not any of the auto resize for the web etc options.

So for CinC use I would resize to 1,000 pixels on the long edge and 96 ppi. Again, this is slightly variable.

Then I might do an extra sharpen if required. Somewhere around 40 or 50% with 0.5 pixel radius and threshold 1.

Other people may do things slightly differently but the principles should be similar.

[GrahamS]

Binnur, you are compounding one problem with another. You should not use noise reduction as a tool to reduce the effect of over-sharpening. As Geoff has said, reduce noise only if necessary as a first step in the editing process and sharpen only after re-sizing as a final step.

[bnnrcn]

Thank you Graham .Noise reduction wasn't my intention actually but the image got so crispy that I thought the noice reduction with preserve details slider dragged to zero would help.The thing is that the image has got too many small details that it looks really bad when downsized.So,I think it is better to stay away from shooting this kind of photos.This is what I have learnt today by experiencing

Binnur, you are compounding one problem with another. You should not use noise reduction as a tool to reduce the effect of over-sharpening. As Geoff has said, reduce noise only if necessary as a first step in the editing process and sharpen only after re-sizing as a final step.

[bnnrcn]

Hi Geoff,I tried and realised that it is impossible downsizing an image without choosing a resampling option in PS CC.So,how do you down size your image simply as you said in your post above? Do you choose a resampling option like 'automatic' as well?

[Geoff F]

I'm using the earlier version so things may be slightly different; but I expect that Automatic adds Bicubic Sharpener for reductions or Bicubic Smoother for enlargements and automatically decides which is which then adds a standard amount.

I use the normal Bicubic Interpolation option which doesn't do anything else. Do you have that choice?

[IzzieK]

Yes John,it looks better with the original size, but I had to resize it for web and I ended with such a result,that's why I started a thread.

Now I see where you problem is, Binnur....No...Binnur. Do not save it for the web if you are going to upload it here at CiC...after resizing: To resize, press CTRL + I then type 1200 or 1000 or the biggest for this website I think is 1600. Then go to SAVE AS not SAVE FOR THE WEB. Then upload it here at CiC. You will get better view of the image...

[bnnrcn]

Isabel I wrote it wrongly.I meant I resized it for CIC not for the web.And I didn't save it for the web,I just saved it with save as funtion as usual.

Now I see where you problem is, Binnur....No...Binnur. Do not save it for the web if you are going to upload it here at CiC...after resizing: To resize, press CTRL + I then type 1200 or 1000 or the biggest for this website I think is 1600. Then go to SAVE AS not SAVE FOR THE WEB. Then upload it here at CiC. You will get better view of the image...

[bnnrcn]

John I used wrong word in my post,I was going to say resize for CIC but I said resize for web.I think it made people confused that's why I wanted to correct my mistake

Yes John,it looks better with the original size,

but I had to resize it for web and I ended with such a result,that's why I started a thread.

[Geoff F]

Yes Izzie, that is what I do. Use Save As to save the internet intended images in a separate folder created for that purpose and upload from there.

In reality, my main computer isn't connected to the internet so I use a transferrable flash drive as a folder/connection device.

You should be able to use Save for the web but suitable settings are required for best effect (not the auto options). I found this was confusing and took more time than a simple Save As with exactly the settings which I wanted.

[bnnrcn]

Geoff,there are 7 options for resampling in PS CC.It exactly says so: Automatic, Preserve Details(enlargement), Bicubic Smoother (enlargement), Bicubic Sharper(reduction), Bicubic (smooth gradients), Nearest Neighbor (hard edges), Bilinear.

I'm using the earlier version so things may be slightly different; but I expect that Automatic adds Bicubic Sharpener for reductions or Bicubic Smoother for enlargements and automatically decides which is which then adds a standard amount.

I use the normal Bicubic Interpolation option which doesn't do anything else. Do you have that choice?

[Geoff F]

I would suspect that Bicubic (smooth gradients) is the one which doesn't automatically add 'enhancements' so that is the one I would try. There has to be a neutral option for doing nothing except resizing; otherwise professionals wouldn't use the software.