Night Sky

[joebranko]

This is an experiment in using RAW and TIFF. I had been using RAW and exporting in jpeg. It made no sense so I did some research. Turns out that I should be using tiff to export. So I tried it today. The shot is not good; lots of noise, hand held, blah blah blah. The experiment is to see if I can upload a pic to CiC in tiff. Here goes.........



Well it uploaded but it seems to have been converted to a jpeg file!

[Donald]

Yep.

It will always upload as a JPEG. Why did you want to upload it as a TIFF?

I'm not sure what you mean by, "Turns out that I should be using tiff to export".

Are you confusing two things? Firstly, there is what you do on your computer. You process a RAW file and you export it to another folder on your computer for possible further processing. I always export this as a TIFF.

Then, you do your further processing and you export the finished image, for printing, posting online, or both, to a folder on your computer. I always save that file as a JPEG (some people save it as a PNG, or in other formats).

So I have three files of the same image - a RAW, a TIFF and a JPEG.

The only one that will ever be posted onto a forum such as this is the JPEG. I wouldn't describe that action of posting online as 'exporting'. That's why I'm wondering if you're confusing two different things?

[joebranko]

Yep.

It will always upload as a JPEG. Why did you want to upload it as a TIFF?

I'm not sure what you mean by, "Turns out that I should be using tiff to export".

Are you confusing two things? Firstly, there is what you do on your computer. You process a RAW file and you export it to another folder on your computer for possible further processing. I always export this as a TIFF.

Then, you do your further processing and you export the finished image, for printing, posting online, or both, to a folder on your computer. I always save that file as a JPEG (some people save it as a PNG, or in other formats).

So I have three files of the same image - a RAW, a TIFF and a JPEG.

The only one that will ever be posted onto a forum such as this is the JPEG. I wouldn't describe that action of posting online as 'exporting'. That's why I'm wondering if you're confusing two different things?

I had not been using RAW until recently. Since I decided to use RAW I have been importing my pics into Lightroom where I process them. On completion of processing I export them to a folder as a JPEG file and from there I post on line. My thoughts were that if I am posting on line in JPEG and losing detail through compression, what is the point in capturing the images in RAW? I thought if I could share my pics in TIFF I would not lose detail through compression. Your system of having three files for each shot , a RAW a TIFF and a Jpeg seems to cover all the bases!

[Donald]

Okay, Joe. I see where you're coming from.

That thing about compression and loss or non-loss is absolutely right. But that comes in to play when you're talking about the capture of the photograph (RAW v JPEG) and in post-processing. You're absolutely right that you want to work with lossless formats (TIFF) at that stage. But once you have your final picture and you're sitting back admiring it and thinking 'Yes, that's it', that's the time to re-size it down and save it as a JPEG ready for posting online (And if you're going to print it, don't do the re-sizing down bit. Keep it big).

[joebranko]

Okay, Joe. I see where you're coming from.

That thing about compression and loss or non-loss is absolutely right. But that comes in to play when you're talking about the capture of the photograph (RAW v JPEG) and in post-processing. You're absolutely right that you want to work with lossless formats (TIFF) at that stage. But once you have your final picture and you're sitting back admiring it and thinking 'Yes, that's it', that's the time to re-size it down and save it as a JPEG ready for posting online (And if you're going to print it, don't do the re-sizing down bit. Keep it big).

Thanks Donald. I guess the bottom line is, if all I intend is to post it on line, is there any advantage to capturing it in RAW and converting it to jpeg vs capturing it in jpeg? Is the end product any better if I start in RAW and at the end convert to jpeg? I appreciate your insight into this.

[Donald]

Thanks Donald. I guess the bottom line is, if all I intend is to post it on line, is there any advantage to capturing it in RAW and converting it to jpeg vs capturing it in jpeg? Is the end product any better if I start in RAW and at the end convert to jpeg? I appreciate your insight into this.

I would say definitely yes.

Even if you only intend to publish your work online, you want it to be the very best it can be. You want to have total creative control to make the image that you want others to see. Stick to JPEG and you're leaving most of the post-processing to the camera. Just as you post process if it's a RAW file, the camera will do post-processing if it's a JPEG and give you what the computer progammer who made all the settings that are in your camera, thinks your picture should look like.

So unless you're someone like a professional newspaper photographer who needs to get images down the line to the picture editor fast and doesn't have the need or time for artistic post-processing, then shoot RAW and work on it afterwards.

As I've written on here many times before, clicking the shutter is the end of the first part of making an image.

[James G]

Hi Joe,
I and a fair majority of the people on this forum would always advise capturing in raw for the reasons Donald has already outlined.

The reality is that if you 'capture' in jpeg, you are letting your camera (manufacturer) make decisions about how the jpeg will be generated within camera.

I can't remember the exact figures, but this results in the loss of up to 75% of the original captured raw data which cannot be recovered later.

Lightroom is a pretty powerful bit of software, which gives you, rather than the camera the flexibility to decide exactly how you want to process the image. Arguably, this flexibility is greatly compromised if the image you are working on has been pre-processed in the camera and a large proportion of the original capture data has been lost.

There is however a middle ground position to capture both raw and jgeg simultaneously. You can then use the jpeg as a proof/guide version.

As regards only wanting post online, I think you need to consider your own processing rig in the whole decision to capture in raw or not.
I post some images and print some of them. In general though, the decision to post or print is dependent in how satisfactory the processing is on my monitor. So, personally, I prefer not to limit any processing options and always capture raw.

Hope this helps....
James

[joebranko]

Okay, Joe. I see where you're coming from.

That thing about compression and loss or non-loss is absolutely right. But that comes in to play when you're talking about the capture of the photograph (RAW v JPEG) and in post-processing. You're absolutely right that you want to work with lossless formats (TIFF) at that stage. But once you have your final picture and you're sitting back admiring it and thinking 'Yes, that's it', that's the time to re-size it down and save it as a JPEG ready for posting online (And if you're going to print it, don't do the re-sizing down bit. Keep it big).

Thanks Donald.

[joebranko]

Hi Joe,
I and a fair majority of the people on this forum would always advise capturing in raw for the reasons Donald has already outlined.

The reality is that if you 'capture' in jpeg, you are letting your camera (manufacturer) make decisions about how the jpeg will be generated within camera.

I can't remember the exact figures, but this results in the loss of up to 75% of the original captured raw data which cannot be recovered later.

Lightroom is a pretty powerful bit of software, which gives you, rather than the camera the flexibility to decide exactly how you want to process the image. Arguably, this flexibility is greatly compromised if the image you are working on has been pre-processed in the camera and a large proportion of the original capture data has been lost.

There is however a middle ground position to capture both raw and jgeg simultaneously. You can then use the jpeg as a proof/guide version.

As regards only wanting post online, I think you need to consider your own processing rig in the whole decision to capture in raw or not.
I post some images and print some of them. In general though, the decision to post or print is dependent in how satisfactory the processing is on my monitor. So, personally, I prefer not to limit any processing options and always capture raw.

Hope this helps....
James

Yes this does help. Thank you.