Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Rachel - C & C requested

  1. #1
    topol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Oxfordshire, UK
    Posts
    97
    Real Name
    Call me "Norm"

    Rachel - C & C requested

    My first effort at a portrait. I know I need to learn a lot more about lighting.
    Minor PP in Picasa 3 - cropped and used a bit of fill-light.
    There wasn't a lot of space, but should she have stood further from the wall?
    Rachel - C & C requestedRachel by taffopol, on Flickr

    ƒ/4.6 Aperture priority
    12.2 mm
    1/5
    ISO 100
    No flash

  2. #2
    Shadowman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    WNY
    Posts
    36,716
    Real Name
    John

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Nice effort, the lighting looks fine and her proximity to the wall isn't really a problem; I think the soft focus on your subject limits the appeal.

  3. #3

    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Perth, Western Australia
    Posts
    130
    Real Name
    David

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    I don't think the subject to background distance adversely effects this shot.
    You can make out detail in the background, but it is not distracting. The subject is not casting a harsh shadow on the background, which can sometimes be distracting.
    I agree with John's comment on sharpness. Were you using a tripod? 1/5s is pretty tough to hand hold.

  4. #4
    Moderator Manfred M's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    22,161
    Real Name
    Manfred Mueller

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Thanks for posting this image, Norm. We should be able to have a fairly interesting discussion on the whole field of portraiture, and in this case, really what amounts to a fairly formal head & shoulders shot. I see that you are shooting with a Fujifilm FinePix SL300; from the specs it has a 3-129mm lens which equates to a 24-720mm full-frame equivalent. This means your 12.2mm focal length works out to about 98mm FF equivalent, which is around where you want to be to minimize facial distortion. I personally tend to shoot a little longer still, but that is more related to my personal style and taste. Around 100mm focal length or longer is where you want to be.

    Pose - nicely posed shot. Your subject appears relaxed and comfortable. Head slightly turned is generally good; eyes are sort of half way between wide open and squinting, so that's really a good way for them to be. A bit of a smile with teeth showing, again a nice balance that works. Positioning of the eyes and nose work for me as well. I might have been a and inch or so higher taking the shot; shooting from above eye level will define the edge of the chin in a way that looks nice and you're there.

    If find the bare shoulder a bit distracting, but that is a really minor issue.

    Positioning - generally we want to position the subject so that the background compliments the shot, without overpowering it. A gently out of focus background is desirable. I generally position my subjects at least 6 - 10 ft away from the background, but this gives me the effect I want. With your small sensor (1/2.3") camera, even this might be a bit close even at fairly wide apertures. You do have a neutral coloured, textured wall, so the impact is not that great. Had you tried this shot against a brightly coloured wall would have reflected the colour back and that often tends to have a negative impact on the shot; either a colour cast or colour bleed. No issue here with the neutral, though.

    Focus - again, I don't know how well you can adjust the focus of your camera, but in this kind of shot you need to ensure that the eyes, or at least the eye closest to the camera is 100% sharp. I think your focus is okay, but the sharpness is not, for a different reason, that I'll get to next.

    Shutter speed - 1/5 is going to be a bit problematic as hand holding a camera with a shutter speed that slow is going to introduce some motion blur, which results in some softness in the shot. Even with image stabilization, I think you are going to have to look at a much shorter exposure time to get a sharp shot. Your shot is definitely a bit soft and this is the most likely reason for it.

    Exposure - looks okay.

    Lighting - this is what portraiture is all about; lighting the face and to a lesser extent the body. A nicely lit portrait should have some soft shadows that help sculpt the face, and I think you have largely accomplished that. No shadows make for a boring image and harsh. I think you have a nice balance in this image. If you ever hear the expression "lighting ratio", this is what we are looking at here, the way that parts of the face are brightly lit while the other half is more in shadow.

    The way that the light is hitting your subject from where you are shooting from is referred to as "broad lighting". This is a fancy way of saying that you are pointing the camera from the same direction as the light source. This type of lighting tends to make faces look a bit fuller and rounder and is generally reserved people with thin faces.

    Had you stepped to the left of your subject a few feet and shot from the shadow side, this is referred to as "short lighting" and tends to have a slimming effect on faces. You might want to consider playing around with various shooting positions and angles (without necessarily changing the position of your subject), just to see what that does for you.

    Regardless, a very nice first try at portraiture and the only real problem is the slow shutter speed. I think you should be very happy with your shot.

  5. #5
    topol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Oxfordshire, UK
    Posts
    97
    Real Name
    Call me "Norm"

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Thanks to all for your comments, especially to Manfred for such a detailed explanation of his points.
    Camera was hand held, I don't have a tripod but if I'd used the EVF that would've lended a bit more stability - I'll have to remember next time.
    Regarding SS, perhaps using Manual rather than AP might be better?
    Light was natural from a window about 10 feet to my right.
    Subject was delighted with the comments about her pose - but what 15 year-old wouldn't be?

  6. #6
    Moderator Manfred M's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Ottawa, Canada
    Posts
    22,161
    Real Name
    Manfred Mueller

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Quote Originally Posted by topol View Post
    I don't have a tripod but if I'd used the EVF that would've lended a bit more stability - I'll have to remember next time.
    Some portrait photographers use a tripod (more in a formal studio setting), but I would have to say that the bulk of portraits are done hand-held.


    Quote Originally Posted by topol View Post
    Regarding SS, perhaps using Manual rather than AP might be better?
    It doesn't much matter if you use one or the other, the exposure still has to be correct. I probably shoot 90% of my work AP, but will adjust ISO and aperture to get me a correct exposure. A bit trickier on your camera because sensor noise can creep in quite quickly at higher ISO settings and the lens is fairly "slow" so you might be close to the limit there. Moving closer to the window (if that is possible) might help drive up the amount of light you have to work with.


    Quote Originally Posted by topol View Post
    Light was natural from a window about 10 feet to my right.
    You can see that in the catch light in her left (camera right) eye.


    Quote Originally Posted by topol View Post
    Subject was delighted with the comments about her pose - but what 15 year-old wouldn't be?
    My daughters, at that age would not have. They developed an "allergy" to having their picture taken when they were quite young. All joking aside, children are usually quite relaxed in front of a camera. Teens can go either way, but adults, they need to coaxed along to pose nicely.

  7. #7
    William W's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Sraylya
    Posts
    4,944
    Real Name
    William (call me Bill)

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Quote Originally Posted by topol View Post
    ƒ/4.6 Aperture priority; 12.2 mm; 1/5; ISO 100 . . . Camera was hand held, I don't have a tripod but if I'd used the EVF that would've lended a bit more stability - I'll have to remember next time. Regarding SS, perhaps using Manual rather than AP might be better?
    A tripod would not have been much assistance to you in this shooting scenario. Neither would have seeking to use devices like the EVF to "lend more stability" been of much assistance to you.

    Your image is soft and, definitively, one major cause is MOTION BLUR.

    There are two types of Motion Blur: MOVEMENT of the SUBJECT (Subject Motion Blur); and MOVEMENT of the CAMERA (Camera Shake).

    I think your camera has Image Stabilization which canNOT be disengaged, in any case even if Image Stabilization could be disengaged, I reckon that you did not disengage it. It is most very probably that the Image Stabilization did a good to very good job at the slow Shutter Speed that you allowed your camera to choose for you.

    Therefore I am very confident that the softness in your image is primarily a result of BLUR due to SUBJECT MOVEMENT not being arrested by a fast enough shutter speed. i.e. the Girl was moving and your camera captured that movement because the shutter speed was too slow.

    I do believe that Manfred was referencing this precise point -that is to say - the cause of the blur and the softness is because the Girl is moving.

    I am underscoring this point because it is a very important point and I also think there is a possibility that so far in this conversation this point is not crystal clear to you.

    Subject Motion Blur has nothing to do with how steady you hold the camera or how efficient and effective is the camera's Image Stabilization. (caveat *1 - a pedantic exception in footnotes)

    If no more light was available to you, then it would have been better to bump the ISO to get a Shutter Speed (indicative and typically) of around 1/125s for Head Shot of a Youth, standing/sitting.

    It is usually always better to have a bit of noise and sharp picture, than no noise and a soft picture.

    So much for the theory - but on the practical side for this particular shot, to get to around 1/125s you'd need to bump the ISO about 4~5 Stops, so you'd be pulling around ISO1600~3200. So at that point you'd have to make a judgement call. I am not familiar with your camera, looking at the tech specs it appears that you have ISO1600 and then there are footnotes about the ISO3200 and ISO6400 which I didn't read . . .

    So with your gear I probably would have chosen ISO1600; expressed to the Subject that "being still" is very important; and I would have taken 8~10 shots.

    Also you could have cribbed a bit more than half stop of Lens Speed (i.e. opened the aperture to around F/4) if you had zoomed out a bit (i.e. zoomed toward the Wide Angle end of the Lens). If you did zoom out you could get to around ISO 800~ISO1000, and as a result, then use a faster shutter speed.

    If you did not move the CAMERA POSITION you would have maintained the same PERSPECTIVE as the sample shot; but then you would have to crop the image to get back to frame it a an Head Shot. It is a compromise. I am not sure which is best as I am not familiar with your camera and specifically how much you can crop at ISO800.

    But nonetheless when one is using a Varying Maximum Aperture Zoom Lens it is relevant to know that there is always the option to shoot wider and crop in post production to get to a faster lens speed and this is an option to always consider.

    *

    Using Manual Mode might have been a better choice for you, but only in regard to - you might have been more aware of the SHUTTER SPEED that you were choosing if YOU had to choose it.

    The point is: IF you choose to use Aperture Priority Mode, YOU still need to consider the SHUTTER SPEED that the camera is selecting for you to use.

    Also, YOU must take appropriate action, if that shutter speed is not suitable for the particular photograph that you want to make.

    WW

    Footnotes:

    Caveat *1 - arguably Panning a moving Subject and using a slow Shutter Speed is the only exception).

    The reasons for the opinion apropos SUBJECT MOVEMENT: Even though image is exceptionally low resolution, analysis of the sample image reveals Subject's Head was moving upwards and slightly to Camera Left, this is evidenced by the trailing edges on her teeth and chin. The Subject's Chest & Jumper at the Neckline were relatively steady.

    These indications would be more obvious if the original file could have been interrogated.

    But, in fact, it is because the sample image is so low resolution and yet still obvious trailing edges can be identified in one area of the frame and not another, that such a certain conclusion of Subject Motion, can be made.

  8. #8
    topol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Oxfordshire, UK
    Posts
    97
    Real Name
    Call me "Norm"

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Thank you for all of that - so much for me to consider.
    In fairness to the subject (15 year-old granddaughter) - it was the first time she'd posed like this, so given OUR inexperience.........

    Quote: [...]there are footnotes about the ISO3200 and ISO6400 which I didn't read . [..]

    From spec:
    Sensitivity Auto,Equivalent to ISO 64 / 100 / 200 / 400 / 800 / 1600 / 3200* / 6400* (Standard Output Sensitivity) * ISO3200 / 6400 is effective in image size S.

    From User Manual:

    Avoiding Blurred Pictures
    If the subject is poorly lit, blurring caused by camera shake can be reduced using the DUAL IS MODE
    option in the setup menu (pg. 103). In shooting mode, blur caused by subject movement is also reduced (dual IS mode).
    Sensitivity is raised when dual IS is in effect.
    Note that blurring may still occur depending on the scene. We recommend that you turn dual IS off when using a tripod.


    and

    Enable image stabilization during shooting ( l CONTINUOUS) or
    only when the shutter button is pressed halfway ( m SHOOTING
    ONLY). OFF turns image stabilization off
    Last edited by topol; 17th March 2015 at 04:58 PM. Reason: Info about camera's image stabilisation

  9. #9
    Rebel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Swansea, Wales
    Posts
    3,122
    Real Name
    Matt

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Glad you posted this Norm, some really good info posted on this thread from Manfred and William.

  10. #10
    klpurkett's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Spokane, WA, USA
    Posts
    254
    Real Name
    Kristy

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Thanks for sharing Norm! I'm trying to learn how to take good people shots right now, too, so the advice above has been helpful! I know all about subject movement, as my most readily available subjects are my very young kids... They simply don't hold still in front of a camera! Good luck!

  11. #11
    Downrigger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Utah and the Adirondacks
    Posts
    1,677
    Real Name
    Mark

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebel View Post
    Glad you posted this Norm, some really good info posted on this thread from Manfred and William.
    Ditto. You bravely sallied forth to the benefit of all. Some great advice here.

  12. #12
    topol's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Oxfordshire, UK
    Posts
    97
    Real Name
    Call me "Norm"

    Re: Rachel - C & C requested

    Matt - Kristy - Mark

    You make me feel warm all over

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •