Need new portrait lens

[mrinmoyvk]

Hi All,

I currently have Nikon 18-55 kit lens and 50mm 1.8
I am mainly interested in pre-wedding/wedding photography. Out of which only in pre-wedding, I will have complete control over light and location however in engagement or wedding most of the times it completely depends on the lighting conditions in the wedding hall or as per the professional photographer's choice (I generally cover friend's weddings in free as I am just starting to go professional).

90% of the times lighting conditions are below average with yellowish cast in lights.
And almost everytime there is a videographer roaming around with his bright yellow halogen light having Tungsten WB.

My budget for new lens is not more than 40,000 INR.

I am more inclined todards 85mm 1.8 for its lowlight capability and amazing sharpness but not always it is possible to frame the shot with fixed focal length in Indian weddings due to large number of people on stage.
One more important point is I have only one camera body so switching between different primes is also difficult.

Most of the wedding shots that I like are head to waist from 15-20 feet distance from the couple. Hardly go for head to toe shots.

Which lens you would suggest for my requirements?

I will be ordering it from the US through my friend who will be comming in next few days.

[Shadowman]

If you are shooting RAW you can work out the WB issues. You're going to need a zoom lens if your shooting distance ranges from close-up to twenty feet, but it sounds like you are doing candid photography for this particular event so I wouldn't rush into lens purchasing if you can help it; don't let your cousin's visit hasten your choice. A fast lens alone won't help under low lighting conditions, you'll need flash for some settings.

[IzzieK]

+1 to John's comment...

[pnodrog]

For the odd wedding I was forced to do I found a 24-120mm on a DX body covered the range I needed.

[Manfred M]

I would strongly suggest that you look at the kit that other wedding photographers use and then build on that.

While I have not been to an Indian wedding, I do know they tend to be rather large, long drawn out affairs that go on for quite some time and any coverage would have to include day and night shooting. The wedding photographers that I know have a minimum of two full-frame cameras and around four or five different professional lenses plus speedlights for each body as a basic kit. Spare batteries for cameras and flash and lots of memory cards. The reason for a minimum of two cameras / flash and some overlap in lenses is backup should one fail. And the equipment does fail, so the redundancy is a requirement.

A single crop frame body with a kit lens + a lower end longer zoom lens for portrait work is simply not going to cut it. The wedding photographers I know primarily work in jpeg and the bulk of the shots that they use are straight out of the camera (auto-white balance is NEVER used).

As one of them put it to me; he spends less than 30 seconds on an image in getting things cleaned up for a client (30 seconds per image and 2000 images shot at a wedding is well over 16 hours of post-wedding work!).

[William W]

Use your money to buy dedicated Flash and buy or make light modifiers and learn how to use them.

Your kit lens and one camera is is fine for pro bono work.

Not having a Flash Unit was a limiting factor for you at the "pre wedding shoot" that you asked about earlier this year.

WW

[rpcrowe]

+1 for getting a "good" flash unit straight away! Learning how to use that flash unit to provide "natural looking" images is another thing that should be on your "must" list! Although, I am well experienced with manual flash, I would definitely consider a unit that has TTL capability with your camera. I would also want a unit that allows High Speed Sync which is a godsend for shooting outdoors with fill flash.

Don't even consider straight-on flash. That produces terrible lighting.

I bounce my flash into a Joe Demb Flash Diffuser Pro.

www.dembflashproducts.com

If these are not available in your area, Chinese substitutes can be had from eBay. These are examples of the units that I might use if I could not obtain a Demb Flash Diffuser Pro.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Flash-Bounce...item3f080e5ef4

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Flash-Diffus...item43d32813c4

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Flash-Reflec...item19f911c2ce

The advantage of the Flash Diffuser Pro is the variable angle FlipIt portion of the rig. This allows for shooting in various locations and even works when there is no ceiling or walls off which to bounce.

Along with the flash and diffuser, I would get a camera-flip bracket (not a flash flip bracket)

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Quick-Flip-F...item20be08d5d0

After you get this setup, I would purchase a zoom lens, preferably a zoom with a constant aperture (which will be expensive). My favorite Canon lens for portraiture is the 70-200mm f/4L IS. I am sure that Nikon has something along that line. But, if I were shooting weddings, I would go the extra mile and get the f/2.8L IS ii version of this lens which would be more versatile with the extra stop of light. Of course, it is heavier and more expensive also.

Next, I would get a second camera - that is necessary for professional (paid) photo gigs. Gear fails at the most inopportune moment. While you can shoot weddings with crop cameras, I would recommend a full frame camera or cameras for professional shooting.

Somewhere between the zoom lens and the second camera, I would recommend that you upgrade your kit lens to a medium focal length zoom with a constant f/2.8 aperture...

If you want go go into the professional ranks, after you have purchased the above equipment, start all over again and purchase duplicates. Redundancy is really necessary in pro photography.

Of course, you will need a decent computer setup along with a good editing program.

I would shoot RAW all the time and also have plenty of memory, extra batteries for my cameras and extra batteries for my flash unit...

The above recommendations are expensive but, they are predicated for a person wanting to enter the field of professional wedding photography. For non-professional shooting, the equipment requirements are not as stringent.

[mrinmoyvk]

I would strongly suggest that you look at the kit that other wedding photographers use and then build on that.

While I have not been to an Indian wedding, I do know they tend to be rather large, long drawn out affairs that go on for quite some time and any coverage would have to include day and night shooting. The wedding photographers that I know have a minimum of two full-frame cameras and around four or five different professional lenses plus speedlights for each body as a basic kit. Spare batteries for cameras and flash and lots of memory cards. The reason for a minimum of two cameras / flash and some overlap in lenses is backup should one fail. And the equipment does fail, so the redundancy is a requirement.

A single crop frame body with a kit lens + a lower end longer zoom lens for portrait work is simply not going to cut it. The wedding photographers I know primarily work in jpeg and the bulk of the shots that they use are straight out of the camera (auto-white balance is NEVER used).

As one of them put it to me; he spends less than 30 seconds on an image in getting things cleaned up for a client (30 seconds per image and 2000 images shot at a wedding is well over 16 hours of post-wedding work!).

Yes, the indian weddings tend to go on for 6-8 hours minimum but the actual wedding ceremony is not more than 3 hours. Rest everything is relatives and friends coming on stage and meeting the newly wed couple. It is expected from photographer to take a group photo of each & everyone when they meet the couple (most boaring task). Also few shots at the time of lunch or dinner are also expected.
I prefer shooting in RAW and 2000 images is way too much for me to give, I hardly shoot those many images . I shoot 300-400 images at most in a wedding & give 40-50 images (excluding those group photos) and spend average of 10-15 min on each image in PP.

Use your money to buy dedicated Flash and buy or make light modifiers and learn how to use them.

Your kit lens and one camera is is fine for pro bono work.

Not having a Flash Unit was a limiting factor for you at the "pre wedding shoot" that you asked about earlier this year.

WW

Yes, one of my friend also suggested to go for Nissin DI866 Mark 2. It is on my list but should I go for lens first or the flash unit as I have only 18-55 and 50mm 1.8
I mean I can manage without external flash for some time but managing without lens is difficult.
I managed pre-wedding with a pop up flash as it was outdoor and I selected the morning time of soft light.



My budget for photography for 2015 is 40,000 INR which can include either of lens or flash.
Should I go for flash first? If so is DI866 Mark 2 good?

[William W]

. . . should I go for lens first or the flash unit as I have only 18-55 and 50mm 1.8. I mean I can manage without external flash for some time but managing without lens is difficult. My budget for photography for 2015 is 40,000 INR which can include either of lens or flash. Should I go for flash first? If so is DI866 Mark 2 good?

Very direct questions.

Equally direct opinion: For the tasks you want to do and the path you want to follow: Flash first. Definitively. No other option.

Expanding:

I mean I can manage without external flash for some time but managing without lens is difficult.

Disagree. Yes some shots you will not use a Flash. But your position and opinion that you can manage without a Flash for an ongoing period of time, seems predicated from a position of not having a Flash to use. As you are not presently using a Flash for the weddings and the pre weddings in your practice sessions, you, therefore are making choices with limited knowledge and even less experience of what can be achieved with Flash when it is used with skill. The point is: one does not know, what one does not know.

On the other hand, one should be able to cover all the wedding with more than adequate results, using only a standard zoom lens (which you have), yes at times that will require hard work and also some very quick movement to get to the correct Camera Viewpoint for the next shot. Yes, it would be nice to have an F/2.8 Standard Zoom, but to a great extent the deft use of Flash can overcome many of the limitations of the F/3.5~5.6 Max Apertures of the Kit Zoom Lens that you have.

I have no experience with Nissan Flash Units and therefore cannot provide comment on them particularly.

My opinion is that your Hot-shoe Flash Head MUST HAVE:

> full TILT and SWIVEL movements (BTW - downwards tilt beyond the vertical, is useful for Wedding work)
> full Nikon TTL functionality
> variable power / Manual setting
> full AF Assist beam functionality (if Nikon DSLRs have that function?)

Preferred and in order of priority and if possible within your budget:

1. > has a guide number / power about 50~58mtrs @ ISO100
2. > has a zoom head
3. > can be used as BOTH a MASTER - AND - SLAVE
4. > has High Speed Sync capabilities (Nikon HSS has another name which I have momentarily forgotten)

(E&OE in those two lists - there might be other points - I was typing and thinking very quickly)

WW

[mrinmoyvk]

Hi Bill,

Thanks for the detailed explaination over flash or lens. I have decided to go for flash. Nissin DI866 M2 has almost all the functionlities you mentioned except for the downward tilt which is present in SB-910. I am completely new in this category. If possible, could you please check and let me know which one is better of http://www.nissindigital.com/di866mkii.html & http://www.nikon.co.in/en_IN/product...edlight-sb-910
Please do consider the price difference as well.

[William W]

Hi Mrinmoy,

I use Canon DSLRs I use Canon Speedlites, and for my Fuji Mirrorless I use a Fuji Speedlite. I have used Nikon Speedlites when I had Nikon SLR gear, but that was several years ago.

I know nothing of the Nissin brand, other than it is discussed often on internet forums and seems to have a popular following.

There is another 3rd party brand – Yongnuo, but I know little of them too and this brand also has a popular following: I think that you should look at this brand also.

Please take no offense: but I am not comfortable to advise you on a budget affected purchase choice, which based upon tech sheets and/or on gear which I have not used first hand.

WW

[Adrian]

Anecdotal only: our recent in-house photographer had two Nissin flash guns and two or three Nikon heads. He always preferred to use his Nikon equipment as he felt he got more predictable and controllable results. He is Australian and I believe he bought his Nissin kit there. It seemed well made to me.

I see no reason why Nissin should not be fine for you as long as the specification meets your current and anticipated needs, especially if price is a factor.

[mrinmoyvk]

No worries Bill, I will find someone who has used a Nissin

[pnodrog]

I used an early Sigma EF series flash for years and it was very reliable. The new Sigma EF-610 or EF-610 DG models have very good specifications and may be worth considering as on B&H they are cheaper than the Nissan Di866 with similar power.

[Manfred M]

Both Nissin and Metz are two well respected third party manufacturers that have been making flash units for a lot longer than Canon and Nikon. I've never owned a Nissen, but used a Metz for many years in my film days.

There are three Chinese companies; Yongnuo, Phottix and Godox, have been getting excellent reviews for their units as well (this is a big change as a couple of years ago, the quality levels seemed to be rather hit and miss back then). I have no personal experience with Yongnuo and Phottix, but recently picked up a Godox Wistro (100% manual, 360 W-s bare bulb flash), that has been getting excellent reviews. The build quality on the Godox seems to be quite good, but is seems to be slightly less polished than the more mainstream competition, but as the unit runs for less than half the price, I'm more than willing to live with it.

[mrinmoyvk]

Hi Bill,

I have replied to your mesasage but cannot see it in sent items, can you please confirm whether you got it?

[William W]

Yes, thank you, I have read your reply.

***

When you send a PM note that there is at the bottom an option and a check box that you must click so that you keep a copy.

"Save a copy of this message in your Sent Items folder.

Stores a copy of the message you send in the 'Sent Items' folder."

WW