A similar but warmer and brighter scene

[bnnrcn]

I uploaded a similar but darker version of this scene before.I edited this image differently because there were some sunrays in the frame. I also mainly used Viveza for this edit. I think my main software will be Viveza for color images as my main software for B&W images is SEP2. I find Nik Software very handy and talented. So PS CC will be helping as a secondary software. I'm glad that at last I made up my mind about which software to use when and where !

I think I will be back to editing my B&W images after this color one. I just want to say that editing color images and B&W images are totaly different from each other.Although you deal with colors in color images, you deal with the tones of grey in B&W images. So, I think I will have to make a decision about which way to go soon. I tend to choose B&W though

C&C appreciated

[deetheturk]

Hi Binnur, I am only looking at the image on my iPad at the moment but it looks good to me, the sky is beautiful

[Mike Buckley]

I don't have anything to mention about your post-processing because I can't adequately appreciate this style. I do appreciate, though, the comfort you must be feeling to have established a workflow and portfolio of software applications that fits your needs.

[Shadowman]

Much better. If you aren't going to process your images in color, you might want to consider hiring a photo editor or else we'll miss out on scenes such as this.

[Geoff F]

That version seems to have more 'impact' on the water area.

[bnnrcn]

Thank you David I hope this one is bright enough for you

Hi Binnur, I am only looking at the image on my iPad at the moment but it looks good to me, the sky is beautiful

[bnnrcn]

Thanks Mike. It is a relief indeed to decide what to do with so many editing tools

I don't have anything to mention about your post-processing because I can't adequately appreciate this style. I do appreciate, though, the comfort you must be feeling to have established a workflow and portfolio of software applications that fits your needs.

[bnnrcn]

Thank you John It is a dilemma for me indeed to process color images or not. I bought a motorbike a couple of weeks ago so that I could go to the counrtyside to shoot better scenes.I'm also collecting some maps about the villages around. I might come across some colorful and beautiful landscapes to shoot and I don't know how I will feel about editing them I will see when the time comes

Much better. If you aren't going to process your images in color, you might want to consider hiring a photo editor or else we'll miss out on scenes such as this.

[bnnrcn]

Thanks for looking and commenting Geoff Yes the two versions of the similar scenes have different moods.

That version seems to have more 'impact' on the water area.

[Shadowman]

Thank you John It is a dilemma for me indeed to process color images or not. I bought a motorbike a couple of weeks ago so that I could go to the counrtyside to shoot better scenes.I'm also collecting some maps about the villages around. I might come across some colorful and beautiful landscapes to shoot and I don't know how I will feel about editing them I will see when the time comes

Binnur,

It's interesting to hear that you prefer black and white when most photographers edit the color version to get the best monochrome conversion. Do you follow that workflow?

[Mike Buckley]

Binnur, It's interesting to hear that you prefer black and white when most photographers edit the color version to get the best monochrome conversion. Do you follow that workflow?

I appreciate that you asked Binnur, but I wonder if you're aware of the discussions that several of us have had about that. Though I make monochrome versions by first preparing the color version, that's only because that's how I learned how to do it and because I'm comfortable with that workflow. I have never seen any empirical evidence proving that my workflow should be superior and that includes Vincent Versace's book explaining in great detail that he maximizes the color version before converting.

I ask you to consider whether you really know that most photographers edit the color version first to get the best monochrome version. I ask because I can't imagine how anyone would know what process most photographers use.

It's expecially interesting to me that though Nik's Silver Efex Pro is widely recognized as one of the best software applications for making monochrome conversions, there is nothing implicit much less explicit about the software or its instructions suggesting that tweaking the color version first is ideal.

[Shadowman]

I appreciate that you asked Binnur, but I wonder if you're aware of the discussions that several of us have had about that. Though I make monochrome versions by first preparing the color version, that's only because that's how I learned how to do it and because I'm comfortable with that workflow. I have never seen any empirical evidence proving that my workflow should be superior and that includes Vincent Versace's book explaining in great detail that he maximizes the color version before converting.

I ask you to consider whether you really know that most photographers edit the color version first to get the best monochrome version. I ask because I can't imagine how anyone would know what process most photographers use.

It's expecially interesting to me that though Nik's Silver Efex Pro is widely recognized as one of the best software applications for making monochrome conversions, there is nothing implicit much less explicit about the software or its instructions suggesting that tweaking the color version first is ideal.

Hi Mike,

This is NIK software suggested workflow: https://support.google.com/nikcollec..._topic=3000839
Doesn't mean everyone has to follow it. My personal introduction to monochrome conversion was through reading Scott Kelby/Matt Kloskowski's Elements book for Digital Photographers and there were two ways, possibly three ways of converting images to black and white: during CameraRAW conversion and through a full workflow which consisted of color editing first. I've read numerous other texts and they've all followed the same practice, however each author explains that the final method is up to the photographer. When I asked Binnur about her workflow it was to find out how she converts images and if she was converting for color first; I wondered what could be causing her to dislike processing for color.

[bnnrcn]

Hi John As Mike explained before me, there is no certain way for monochrome conversions. First I make some minor adjustments to the raw image in ACR , next I take the image to SEP2 and I make my main conversion there and for the last step I take the image to PS CC for the things like cloning,resizing etc. which I can't make with SEP2. I always use smart filters while following this work flow and I can always get back to my old settings if I need to change them.As far as I know from the discussions we had about the matter in CinC, Manfred doesn't edit the color image thoroughly before converting to B&W either. I don't know if he mainly uses SEP2 though.This is how I feel comfortable about my B&W conversions, but I think everyone has their own way to go

Binnur,

It's interesting to hear that you prefer black and white when most photographers edit the color version to get the best monochrome conversion. Do you follow that workflow?

[bnnrcn]

Thanks for the link John I haven't seen it before but I don't believe that such a certain work flow can be applied to each image. I think that is a general workflow to promote Nik Software, because it covers all parts of the software even like Dfine and CEP4.

Hi Mike,

This is NIK software suggested workflow: https://support.google.com/nikcollec..._topic=3000839
Doesn't mean everyone has to follow it. My personal introduction to monochrome conversion was through reading Scott Kelby/Matt Kloskowski's Elements book for Digital Photographers and there were two ways, possibly three ways of converting images to black and white: during CameraRAW conversion and through a full workflow which consisted of color editing first. I've read numerous other texts and they've all followed the same practice, however each author explains that the final method is up to the photographer. When I asked Binnur about her workflow it was to find out how she converts images and if she was converting for color first; I wondered what could be causing her to dislike processing for color.

[bnnrcn]

Thanks for explaining before me Mike. I was supposed to be sleeping at this time of day but my dog woke me up for some reason and I logged into CinC to see what is going on . I had better get back to sleep now

I appreciate that you asked Binnur, but I wonder if you're aware of the discussions that several of us have had about that. Though I make monochrome versions by first preparing the color version, that's only because that's how I learned how to do it and because I'm comfortable with that workflow. I have never seen any empirical evidence proving that my workflow should be superior and that includes Vincent Versace's book explaining in great detail that he maximizes the color version before converting.

I ask you to consider whether you really know that most photographers edit the color version first to get the best monochrome version. I ask because I can't imagine how anyone would know what process most photographers use.

It's expecially interesting to me that though Nik's Silver Efex Pro is widely recognized as one of the best software applications for making monochrome conversions, there is nothing implicit much less explicit about the software or its instructions suggesting that tweaking the color version first is ideal.

[Mike Buckley]

Thanks, John, for providing that workflow suggested for using the Google/Nik suite. I've never seen that. Even so, that workflow seems to be designed to justify going to the time to learn the entire suite of products and to going to the expense of licensing them. Notice that it makes no attempt to explain why treating the color version before converting to monochrome is important. That speaks volumes to me.

[Shadowman]

Hi John As Mike explained before me, there is no certain way for monochrome conversions. First I make some minor adjustments to the raw image in ACR , next I take the image to SEP2 and I make my main conversion there and for the last step I take the image to PS CC for the things like cloning,resizing etc. which I can't make with SEP2. I always use smart filters while following this work flow and I can always get back to my old settings if I need to change them.As far as I know from the discussions we had about the matter in CinC, Manfred doesn't edit the color image thoroughly before converting to B&W either. I don't know if he mainly uses SEP2 though.This is how I feel comfortable about my B&W conversions, but I think everyone has their own way to go

Hi Binnur,

Thanks for the explanation, I guess what I was really after was a reason for your preference of black and white; I thought perhaps you found color editing too difficult.

[Shadowman]

Thanks, John, for providing that workflow suggested for using the Google/Nik suite. I've never seen that. Even so, that workflow seems to be designed to justify going to the time to learn the entire suite of products and to going to the expense of licensing them. Notice that it makes no attempt to explain why treating the color version before converting to monochrome is important. That speaks volumes to me.

Mike,

Uwe Steinmueller/Juergen Gulbiins (Fine Art Printing for Photographers) give a more detailed reason for converting a color image to b & w and one reason is to have total control over "printed" output, but again they state that there are more ways to convert than their suggested method. I don't propose one method over the other, I was just curious about Binnur's particular method.

[Mike Buckley]

Mike,

Uwe Steinmueller/Juergen Gulbiins (Fine Art Printing for Photographers) give a more detailed reason for converting a color image to b & w

Just to be clear, I agree that almost all times with very few exceptions, it is best to convert to monochrome rather than desaturate to monochrome. The point I was making is that I've never seen any empirical evidence or even an attempt to provide any explaining why tweaking the color version before converting to monochrome is important. As an example, the only explanation that Versace explains in his book is that doing so maintains the "structure." He doesn't attempt to explain why or how it maintains the "structure;" he doesn't attempt to define "structure;" and he doesn't attempt to explain why maintaining the "structure" is important. (Note that Google/Nik uses a Versace photo to help market Silver Efex Pro.)

[bnnrcn]

Hi John. I'm back again as I can't sleep anyway My reason for my preference of B&W is totaly different from what you think. I actually find color editing a bit boring and I don't want to spend a long time on it. Because a sunset image is a sunset image and you just have to edit it according to what a sunset image should be similar to. But in a B&W conversion you can even create a night photo from an image taken in the middle of the day or a stormy effect out of an afternoon shot with nice clouds in the sky, because you are dealing with the tones of grey instead of colors. So I don't feel limited and I can edit the image according to what my heart tells me when I sit in front of the image.That's why I can spend hours for B&W conversions without getting bored

Hi Binnur,

Thanks for the explanation, I guess what I was really after was a reason for your preference of black and white; I thought perhaps you found color editing too difficult.