Mixed day...for C&C

[IzzieK]

I embarked on doing some more polishing of my hummers this morning...I had a hard time, trying to get closer with the 150-500mm, but I did it, I think...so next was to try the 70-300mm but I need to get closer still, about 4 feet from the railings. Just as I came back from my kichenette and shut the door to the deck, this hummer flew right about 3 feet from my head, my shoulders and my face, checking me out. Then he posed for me for my 150-500mm..here is the result...

1


Still a bit noisy so I got my 70-300mm to try. Didn't have a chance because I started moving the little portable fireplace so I can sit nearer to the feeder. I have to take a shot of this....!! Guess what I found? so I went inside and changed my lens to the 105mm...

2..a moth or butterfly whatever this is hanging on the side of it...I was in a very tight space near the railings and the step leading to the main deck so I just did the best I could under the circumstances...now I know what getting up means when you are folded down on the floor trying to get up...while trying to hold on to your expensive camera...it ain't funny...when visitors suddenly found you like that... I must ban them for surprising me like that...



I still need to get closer on the hummer so I do not have crop...I am not happy with it but despite my difficulty, I like both though I like the moth shot better. I will do another experiment tomorrow...

Thanks folks for following my progress...

[Ziggy]

Think that is a Moth Izzie.

Catch you again when the sun breaks the horizon.

[Loose Canon]

Still a bit noisy so I got my 70-300mm to try.

Miss Izzie, the noise issue has nothing to do with what lens you choose!

The problem is (vastly) underexposing in-camera. Anywhere from 1-1/2 -2 stops from what I can tell. Maybe a bit more if you try exposing to the right and bringing it back down a bit in post (being careful not to over do it of course). If you are cropping this magnifies the issue. EXIF is telling me f/8 @ 1/1600. You could get some wiggle room on this if you open up to f/5.6 or even f/4.0 if you can. Getting more light into the camera is the only way you are going to mitigate the noise. No other reason for not getting great results at ISO 640.

This one is otherwise a great shot and you nailed everything else (focus/wing blur).

[IzzieK]

Think that is a Moth Izzie.

Catch you again when the sun breaks the horizon.

Thanks Jim...

[IzzieK]

Miss Izzie, the noise issue has nothing to do with what lens you choose!

The problem is (vastly) underexposing in-camera. Anywhere from 1-1/2 -2 stops from what I can tell. Maybe a bit more if you try exposing to the right and bringing it back down a bit in post (being careful not to over do it of course). If you are cropping this magnifies the issue. EXIF is telling me f/8 @ 1/1600. You could get some wiggle room on this if you open up to f/5.6 or even f/4.0 if you can. Getting more light into the camera is the only way you are going to mitigate the noise. No other reason for not getting great results at ISO 640.

This one is otherwise a great shot and you nailed everything else (focus/wing blur).

Dear Terry...I am still in experimentation stage of this hummingbird thingie shooting. I will try everything and so far has been on edge all day so I diverted to experimenting with my lens...one by one. And yes, this is a difficult bird to photograph so I started reading about it this morning and I will try to experiment on flash. I had also tried exposing to the right (ETR) at 5.6 and 7.1 at ISO400. I got still shots and they are very good but my aim is to freeze the wings, use my 70-300mm or even the 150-500mm again so I will be farther to the bird. I found that I can use my 70-300mm but I have to be about 4 to 5 feet away from the feeder to get a good shot even at 1/800 speed...since I now know that the wings of these birds moves at 50 - 500 flutters/second, the aim is to catch it when it stops at the end of the flutter stage, right before it goes away from sight...this is comparable to high speed sync shoot...but with a difference -- even at the highest 1/8000 SS it is impossible to catch the wing fluttering steady enough not to show a blur. I was following a post from long ago of a member here that said that to catch the freezing of the wing, you have to go up to 1/2000 SS. I have tried that...I had fiddled with my EC, aperture, shutter speed many different ways but I still cannot get the freezing of the wing...this morning I read that the most successful way to freeze the wings is to use flash. I am going to do that this morning, so helped me God if I wake up early as I have been up at nearly 2am to watch the meteor showers...I got the skies all right but the meteor is quicker than the hummers in this case so I gave up and came here to CiC instead since I am already awake anyway...

The hummers are getting used to me now so it will be easy to continue on my experiment as soon as the days gets brighter...and also remember to use my other tripod with the ballhead too...

Goodnight or good morning whichever one comes first....I am getting crossed eyed now...thank you for your help. really do appreciate anything that I can get...

[Acorn]

It seems, Izzie, that light was probably not on your side again as the shot looks somewhat underexposed. But I understand Humming Birds are not easy to photograph owing to the rapid rate of knots that their wings flutter. What were your settings with the 150-500?

[Shadowman]

Nice efforts. Are you shooting multiple exposures on the hummer series?

[bnnrcn]

Better trials Isabel

[chauncey]

this hummer flew right about 3 feet from my head, my shoulders and my face, checking me out

Don't change your deodorant.

The problem is (vastly) underexposing in-camera.

Exposure...I don't know why Nikon cannot display a histogram in live view and Canon does...
it has been the key to my nailing exposure for years.

the most successful way to freeze the wings is to use flash

True enough but...will it frighten the birds and...artistically, is it necessary?

[IzzieK]

It seems, Izzie, that light was probably not on your side again as the shot looks somewhat underexposed. But I understand Humming Birds are not easy to photograph owing to the rapid rate of knots that their wings flutter. What were your settings with the 150-500?

No, it wasn't...I am sorry...Oh, I had forgotten already...OK, I got it from the EXIF:

Metering Mode is Matrix in Nikon (Evaluative in Canon)
No Flash
Focal length: 450mm
I tried Auto White Balance and did not like it so I edited in PP
F/8
1/1600

No matter what I do, I will not be able to get this properly yet because from all I have read so far this morning and this afternoon, to be able to freeze the wings, which I was trying to do, I would need two flashes on each side of the feeder (or the bird). How can I really know where the hummer will show up? They do show up eventually but the positioning of the flash is a little bit tricky...I need to study them more and observe them more as this morning what happened was that I was shooting from near the feeder and Bill was continuing my weeding down below...the bird circled his head and the other one came and they both flew away. They did not go to the feeder...how frustrating is that?! Then when I put my camera down on the chair, it did the same thing to me...

So I gave up and continue with my weeding to help Bill. Can you help me?

[IzzieK]

Nice efforts. Are you shooting multiple exposures on the hummer series?

Yes, John, I am...I rotated my selection to CH instead of the usual CL that I used to have...so that when I click the button, it will take some fast shots...

I am not giving up yet...these hummers are starting to annoy me but I will persevere until I get it...On one of the articles that I was reading awhile ago, it says that if you only get the body sharp but not the wings, it is considered a snapshot...I am disappointed....

[IzzieK]

[QUOTE]

Don't change your deodorant.

Nope...I cannot use a flavoured deodorant, it has to be no smell or whatever that is called...because I am easily targeted by the bugs if I smell flowery or sumpin'...

Exposure...I don't know why Nikon cannot display a histogram in live view and Canon does...
it has been the key to my nailing exposure for years.

I used to have an Olympus 4/3 camera that has a live view histogram and I love that feature very much. In a Nikon you have to shoot first then analyze your histogram or the now new RGB Highlight histogram...

True enough but...will it frighten the birds and...artistically, is it necessary?

Yesterday afternoon, that is what exactly I did, just use my flash for the birds to get used to...actually they did not come or a while,,,15 minutes later it was like nothing happened or was happening, I merrily flash them without actually going behind my camera to look if the shot is sharpened...then they got used to it more...so when I went to see them this morning to do some serious shots, I only had half an hour and I ran out of battery...I decided to do my garden instead...

Thanks for your tongue-in-cheek comment...do appreciate it too...

[Stagecoach]

Hi Izzie,

I don't know why Nikon cannot display a histogram in live view and Canon does...
it has been the key to my nailing exposure for years.

In a Nikon you have to shoot first then analyze your histogram or the now new RGB Highlight histogram...

The D800 so I suspect the D810 as well has the histogram function available in live view. If it would be worth using in this scenario is another matter

As for comments on the web that say if the wings are not frozen it's only a snapshot (I too have read this article) that is absolute RUBBISH. It also raises the question of what a snapshot is, but that's another subject.

So why if we take pictures of planes and choppers in the air do we strive to show movement in the whirly bits

Coffee time now..................................

Grahame

[IzzieK]

Hi Izzie,

The D800 so I suspect the D810 as well has the histogram function available in live view. If it would be worth using in this scenario is another matter

As for comments on the web that say if the wings are not frozen it's only a snapshot (I too have read this article) that is absolute RUBBISH. It also raises the question of what a snapshot is, but that's another subject.

So why if we take pictures of planes and choppers in the air do we strive to show movement in the whirly bits

Coffee time now..................................

Grahame

I do not use live view much only to do some checking of my setting but I will look into it. I did not know it has that feature, why in live view? My ex-Olympus is pretty much like a review point of view that as you move your camera or your lens, it showed the histogram and you go from there...I missed that...Live view is too much tasking for the battery...pretty much anything that you load in the Nikon is battery intensive. I was thinking of looking for my "battery assistant" -- one that plugs on the wall instead of using an actual battery...I have one but I put it in a "safe place"... now I can't find it...

Good analogy on propellers...but you must admit the author has some nice shots of the hummer...I also was reading on one of the forums about hummingbirds and the guy showed his deck setting with lots of speedlights and flashes and even a builder's light with a stand...that setting is an overkill for me...if that will be the case and I have to imitate what he'd done, I will just rather enjoy sitting on my deck chair on a hot day with a cold glass of water nearby and watch my birds...

Oh btw, I noticed the hummers, both of the parents were telling me something as they circle me a few times ... so I took out my first bowl I used as my bird feeder and fill it a little bit of the nectar for the bees to go to and during half an hour, I kept moving and moving it further from the hummer feeder. The birds appreciated it and they just go about their merry way going to the feeder more often...and no, I didn't take any shot..everytime I read some hummer article, it makes me feel I can't do it with what I have... I am not giving up yet, just thinking...

Thanks again, Grahame...

[Cantab]

Good analogy on propellers...but you must admit the author has some nice shots of the hummer...I also was reading on one of the forums about hummingbirds and the guy showed his deck setting with lots of speedlights and flashes and even a builder's light with a stand...that setting is an overkill for me...if that will be the case and I have to imitate what he'd done, I will just rather enjoy sitting on my deck chair on a hot day with a cold glass of water nearby and watch my birds...

Izzie, I'll begin by saying I've never tried taking a photograph of a hummingbird. But, having said that, I think that a photo that has the head and eyes in sharp focus can be a really good image. After all, when we (or at least I) look at hummingbirds, all we see of their wings is a blur. Why should we want to see more in a photograph? I suppose the only exeption might be if we were taking photographs for a book intended to help people identify different types of birds.

[James G]

Izzie,
We don't have Hummingbirds in the UK, so I'm never likely to try capturing one in flight. However, I do photograph Insects/dragonflies/Hoverflies etc in flight. I would never expect to be able to 'freeze' the wing motion.
Now, I was watching a quiz programme this afternoon (it's raining heavily all day), and one of the questions related to 'identifying' a subject from a series of descriptive facts... oddly enough one subject was 'Hummingbird', and one fact... wing beat 80 times a second. I doubt if there is any realistic exposure that could ever freeze wing motion that does not involve some kind of strobe flash.

Your capture is no 'snap' any more that my feeble captures of insects in flight are. Every time I get one, it gives me a 'buzz' ( sorry about the pun).

Keep on snapping!

ps the moth is lovely... aint it odd the way they all hide up in the most awkward places

[IzzieK]

Izzie, I'll begin by saying I've never tried taking a photograph of a hummingbird. But, having said that, I think that a photo that has the head and eyes in sharp focus can be a really good image. After all, when we (or at least I) look at hummingbirds, all we see of their wings is a blur. Why should we want to see more in a photograph? I suppose the only exeption might be if we were taking photographs for a book intended to help people identify different types of birds.

Thanks Bruce for your kind words...after I read this message offline, I begun to look at hummingbirds in a different way and I saw what you mean...it will take some months to be able to achieve my goal of a sharper wing version as when I saw that picture of that guy's setup with his, I thought if I were to devote the rest of my life buying those gears that he has there, it is worth it...but while I am in the thought of I want to perfect this but I do not want it to be my life, I better move on now before I really get hooked...in the meantime, I will enjoy watching them and try to get those bees out of their way...

'Appreciate your comment and feedback...

[IzzieK]

Izzie,
We don't have Hummingbirds in the UK, so I'm never likely to try capturing one in flight. However, I do photograph Insects/dragonflies/Hoverflies etc in flight. I would never expect to be able to 'freeze' the wing motion.
Now, I was watching a quiz programme this afternoon (it's raining heavily all day), and one of the questions related to 'identifying' a subject from a series of descriptive facts... oddly enough one subject was 'Hummingbird', and one fact... wing beat 80 times a second. I doubt if there is any realistic exposure that could ever freeze wing motion that does not involve some kind of strobe flash.

So I heard about the flash and strobes being able to freeze those wings...but I will try to up my shutter speed...next time...

Your capture is no 'snap' any more that my feeble captures of insects in flight are. Every time I get one, it gives me a 'buzz' ( sorry about the pun).

Thank you ... you are very kind as usual...

[/QUOTE]Keep on snapping!

ps the moth is lovely... aint it odd the way they all hide up in the most awkward places [/QUOTE]

Well...at least I realized it was hard to get up quick when my visitors came unexpectedly... just glad I didn't bang my head on the railings...

Thanks for your nice feedback...'appreciate it...