Buying a used Einstein™ E640 Flash Unit and have some concerns about durability

[teigas]

Hope somebody could play some ball with me her if this is right or not right, and things to think about.

I do own two Elinchrom BX 500watts studio flashes, and two Nikon Sb900 speedlights.

The elinchrom flashes do not have any good freezing flash duration, the Sb900 are better, but dont trow so much light.

I shoot dancers for fun perhaps 2-3 times a year and somthines experiment with flash duration.
When I have done this i have borrowed a friends Einstein 640, and that worked really well.

He is now going to sell the kit and offered me to buy it cheaper than the used price he is going to ask.
I have some concerns because i have heard rumors that they break really easy? I live in Norway so to get it repaired I probably have to ship it to the US.

1. So my first question is does anybody have any experience with the einstein and the durability ?

2. If i should buy somthing else that can freeze dancer, that does not break the bank what are my alternatives?

3. Brining in an SB900 or an elinchrome flash for fill light , will that **** it up if i use the einstein on higher power to freeze ?

4. I have attached the complete list of what i get for the price below.
Total sum of new pricee is 1195 dollars in the US, if i where to buy it from the us now, i also would have to pay 25% tax on iit. The used friend price is 424 dollars.


I know its kind of stupid to buy somthing for a really limited use, and only one unit, but I think I might get more in to experimenting with other freezing projects if i buy it.

The price i think is really good, i get all this:
Paul C buff Einstein™ E640 Flash Unit $499.95
Vagabond Mini™ Lithium (120VAC model) $239.95
3-foot heavy-duty light stand $69.95
47" foldable octabox $169.95
10" x 36" foldable stripbox $119.95
foldable stripbox grid 29.95
8.5-inch High Output Reflector $19.95
5º honeycomb grid for the 8.5-inch reflector$24.95
30º honeycomb grid for the 8.5-inch reflector $19.95

Total sum of 1195 dollars for the used special price of 424 dollars.

[Inkanyezi]

You're into the realm of pure physics when you want to freeze action with strobes.

Studio flash, the high power discharge tubes, by design and by necessity have large flash duration. Small electronic flashes, speedlights, strobe, have shorter duration, which can be even more shortened by cutting them off midway before the capacitor is fully discharged. So when cutting the flash intensity, you actually make the exposure time shorter, diminishing the duration of the flash.

There simply is no high power unit capable of freezing very fast action. All strobes that freeze action have rather little power, so they must be well focused on the subject, and simultaneously firing several strobes may provide more light, but also need care to be fired simultaneously, when your aim is to shorten flash duration.

So remotely firing a set of several small flashes may be the way to go when shooting dancers to freeze action. High power flash will never do it, but it should preferrably be smaller flashes, and at best with power cut-off.

A studio flash generally has a duration of about 2 ms, but can have longer duration, up to about 5 ms. A speedlight that's cut-off can have a duration of less than 0.1 ms. A dancer in action moves considerably during 2 ms.

[Manfred M]

I will have to disagree a bit with Urban on this one as the Einstein 640 lights lights, when set to action mode have a fairly fast t.1 time, especially if you drop to 1/4 power or below and quickly heads faster than 1/10 000th second. The specs can be found here:

http://www.paulcbuff.com/e640.php

The main issue with the lights is that there is no service for them available in Europe if something goes wrong with them. That may or may not be a problem for you. I don't tend to use mine for high speed work, but Terry (Loose Canon) does, so if he does not comment on this thread, you might want to contact him via PM.

[teigas]

I will have to disagree a bit with Urban on this one as the Einstein 640 lights lights, when set to action mode have a fairly fast t.1 time, especially if you drop to 1/4 power or below and quickly heads faster than 1/10 000th second. The specs can be found here:

http://www.paulcbuff.com/e640.php

The main issue with the lights is that there is no service for them available in Europe if something goes wrong with them. That may or may not be a problem for you. I don't tend to use mine for high speed work, but Terry (Loose Canon) does, so if he does not comment on this thread, you might want to contact him via PM.

Thank you for your reply. I have tested it before, and it froze the action better than one small sb900 because the sb900 has best t1 or t5 times on its lowest setting, and in the large area it did not trow enough light, compared to the einstein. I have written an email to Einstein to check how much shipping them would cost, and how much the usual repairs.. So think I will make a conclusion when they reply. What Paul C buff flashes do you have and have you had any problems with them? I read that the buttons and the screen somtimes acted up, but that could just be the one guy.

[Manfred M]

So far as I understand, Paul C Buff will not ship to Europe, so unless you can get this equipment elsewhere this will not be a solution.

The only problem I have with one of my lights is that the clamping mechanism for the speed ring sticks a bit and I have to be a bit careful in how I mount my light modifiers. I expect I will have to send it out for repair as some point. I have not had any issues with my other three Einstein lights.

[teigas]

So far as I understand, Paul C Buff will not ship to Europe, so unless you can get this equipment elsewhere this will not be a solution.

The only problem I have with one of my lights is that the clamping mechanism for the speed ring sticks a bit and I have to be a bit careful in how I mount my light modifiers. I expect I will have to send it out for repair as some point. I have not had any issues with my other three Einstein lights.

How many years have you had them ? Have u used them outside also ? Or just inside in a studio ? They do ship if you make a po box in the us, there are services that makes adress for you in the us, they ship to that adress and then to you :P And it stands they accepts repair from europe if they where bought before they closed of to sell to europe... The only question is more if the shipping cost really much it will not be worth it :P ..

[Manfred M]

I have had two of the lights for four years and the second two lights for three years.

I do have the vagabond mini and have used the lights outdoors a few times. I am planning an outdoor shoot in about 2 weeks and am looking at using them for it. I have only ever shot a single light outdoors.

As for mail redirection services in the USA, I have no idea about that as I have never used them

[Loose Canon]

Hi Lars! I’ll play ball!

This is from the Paul C. Buff website regarding their international policies in case you haven’t seen it already. It could definitely be a problem for you in Norway. At the very least a hassle if repairs are needed and for spare parts (modeling bulbs, flash tubes, etc.)

To address your concerns as to reliability with these products, I haven’t had any issues with mine as far as the heads are concerned. I have used them indoors and outdoors and with the Vagabond batteries. The one thing I have had is that I’ve had to replace a couple of the modeling bulbs. I feel this was on me though. I moved the lights while the modeling lights were on, jiggled them probably excessively, and most likely severed the hot filament in the process. I haven’t had any problems with the heads themselves, nor have I had to replace any flash tubes in probably thousands of pops by now.

I might add that I keep the lights cased for transport for location shots and I have never travelled with them by the airlines or in any other way than just put them in the truck and drive to my location. I don’t baby them but at the same time I don’t abuse them either and they are not tossed around by baggage handlers. Anything is going to be subject to needing repair and one hopes it won’t happen. But to think something (anything) will last forever might not be a wise premise.

These lights are the best, and offer the most power I know of, at the price point if you want something for high speed motion freezing purposes. If you want something else that offers the power for this purpose you are going to get into around double the cost for quality. They are presently the best choice for the money for what they do as far as I know. But I have not recently researched any others at around this price either. Since I went with Buff I have been completely satisfied with their performance and had no need.

Speed lights are cool and offer the duration times, but it seems you have hit the wall with them. And that wall is always the lack of power they provide. It gets rather expensive having to add enough of them, with triggers, to get the job done sometimes and then there is the fun of ganging them in a modifier. And something I noticed missing on your list is the lack of a trigger to fire your Einstein.

But as far your list goes, and in my geographical location, if I found a deal like yours I would have already jumped on it! That’s a great deal and all the better since you know the present owner. I also don’t consider it stupid to get lights that can do for you what you want them to do now, or especially to serve you as you move (or think you might move) into a new direction. I would consider that forward thinking.

As far as mixing different types of lights for you stated purposes? Keep in mind that when it comes to freezing motion, the longest flash duration of any light in the mix will determine how well it freezes. In other words, if your key light is firing at a short enough duration to freeze the action, but you add a fill light, and that fill light is not also firing fast enough to freeze the action, then the action will not be frozen.

[teigas]

Hi Lars! I’ll play ball!

This is from the Paul C. Buff website regarding their international policies in case you haven’t seen it already. It could definitely be a problem for you in Norway. At the very least a hassle if repairs are needed and for spare parts (modeling bulbs, flash tubes, etc.)

To address your concerns as to reliability with these products, I haven’t had any issues with mine as far as the heads are concerned. I have used them indoors and outdoors and with the Vagabond batteries. The one thing I have had is that I’ve had to replace a couple of the modeling bulbs. I feel this was on me though. I moved the lights while the modeling lights were on, jiggled them probably excessively, and most likely severed the hot filament in the process. I haven’t had any problems with the heads themselves, nor have I had to replace any flash tubes in probably thousands of pops by now.

I might add that I keep the lights cased for transport for location shots and I have never travelled with them by the airlines or in any other way than just put them in the truck and drive to my location. I don’t baby them but at the same time I don’t abuse them either and they are not tossed around by baggage handlers. Anything is going to be subject to needing repair and one hopes it won’t happen. But to think something (anything) will last forever might not be a wise premise.

These lights are the best, and offer the most power I know of, at the price point if you want something for high speed motion freezing purposes. If you want something else that offers the power for this purpose you are going to get into around double the cost for quality. They are presently the best choice for the money for what they do as far as I know. But I have not recently researched any others at around this price either. Since I went with Buff I have been completely satisfied with their performance and had no need.

Speed lights are cool and offer the duration times, but it seems you have hit the wall with them. And that wall is always the lack of power they provide. It gets rather expensive having to add enough of them, with triggers, to get the job done sometimes and then there is the fun of ganging them in a modifier. And something I noticed missing on your list is the lack of a trigger to fire your Einstein.

But as far your list goes, and in my geographical location, if I found a deal like yours I would have already jumped on it! That’s a great deal and all the better since you know the present owner. I also don’t consider it stupid to get lights that can do for you what you want them to do now, or especially to serve you as you move (or think you might move) into a new direction. I would consider that forward thinking.

As far as mixing different types of lights for you stated purposes? Keep in mind that when it comes to freezing motion, the longest flash duration of any light in the mix will determine how well it freezes. In other words, if your key light is firing at a short enough duration to freeze the action, but you add a fill light, and that fill light is not also firing fast enough to freeze the action, then the action will not be frozen.

Thank you Loose canon. There are a set of trigger to it, i place on pin in the top of the einstein, and one trigger for the hot shoe.. cant controll anything from it, but it triggers the flash. When i read more i see there is somthing called a cyber commander or somthing for controlling them better?

Yeah I think the deal is really great thats why I am really thinking about it.

When it comes to adding gear or buying parts i can always use this option, i know some of my friends are already using it to buy some car parts etc, or I have som realatives in the US i might can ship it to first and they can ship it to me: What is a freight forwarder? A freight forwarder is a company that organizes shipments to get products from the manufacturer to a customer. In this case, a freight forwarder can be used to ship our products from the U.S. to your international location. Freight forwarders may also be referred to as forwarding agents, personal shoppers, and shipping agents.


When it comes to mixing the lights it would be fine to add lets say two sb900 as long as i keep them in the low power range where they have the best t0.1 times? As long as its not super super super duper short flash duration. Because i don`t think i will be able to get one more einstein head.

How long have you had your einsteins? And how many times a year do you use them you think?

I think when it comes to solutions in europe it seems godox could be the closest: http://www.markkitaoka.com/reviews/r...d600bm-strobe/

Thanks for the answear again.

[Loose Canon]

When i read more i see there is somthing called a cyber commander or somthing for controlling them better?

Yes Lars, there is the Cyber Commander and I use it. With it one may control the light(s) settings from the camera or even as you hold the CC in hand. These settings include but are not limited to on/off, power settings, test firing, bracket flash, groupings, frequency, modeling light on/off and settings, gives you a Ws/t.1 readout for a particular power setting, and more cool stuff. I find it indispensable and it really streamlines the work flow.

When it comes to mixing the lights it would be fine to add lets say two sb900 as long as i keep them in the low power range where they have the best t0.1 times?

Yes, its fine to mix your speedlights with the Einstein, but the speedlights will not have to have the shortest t.1 times of the lights. They will however, have to have an adequate t.1 to stop the motion themselves. The slowest duration of any light in the group determines the motion stopping success. So if your speed lights are not set for a fast enough duration (low enough power) to stop the motion, even if they are used as fill, the motion will not be stopped. Keep in mind that if you allow ambient light to play a role in the shot, it too can have a detrimental effect on stopping motion. For example: For a lot of my high speed stuff I require a maximum t.1 time of 1/8000th sec. as a rule. Therefore, I make sure no light in the group, regardless of how many lights there are in the group, exceeds that duration. I will also not allow ambient light to effect the shot.

How long have you had your einsteins? And how many times a year do you use them you think?

I’ve had my lights close to three years. I will use them around eight times a year and for anywhere from 1-3 weeks at a time during those eight times a year give or take. It is not unusual for me to fire those lights 50-200 times a day when I am shooting. But while I do use them on location, and have no hesitation in doing so, the vast majority is done in a studio setting.

In that time I have replaced 2 or 3 modeling light bulbs and one fuse.

[teigas]

Yes Lars, there is the Cyber Commander and I use it. With it one may control the light(s) settings from the camera or even as you hold the CC in hand. These settings include but are not limited to on/off, power settings, test firing, bracket flash, groupings, frequency, modeling light on/off and settings, gives you a Ws/t.1 readout for a particular power setting, and more cool stuff. I find it indispensable and it really streamlines the work flow.



Yes, its fine to mix your speedlights with the Einstein, but the speedlights will not have to have the shortest t.1 times of the lights. They will however, have to have an adequate t.1 to stop the motion themselves. The slowest duration of any light in the group determines the motion stopping success. So if your speed lights are not set for a fast enough duration (low enough power) to stop the motion, even if they are used as fill, the motion will not be stopped. Keep in mind that if you allow ambient light to play a role in the shot, it too can have a detrimental effect on stopping motion. For example: For a lot of my high speed stuff I require a maximum t.1 time of 1/8000th sec. as a rule. Therefore, I make sure no light in the group, regardless of how many lights there are in the group, exceeds that duration. I will also not allow ambient light to effect the shot.



I’ve had my lights close to three years. I will use them around eight times a year and for anywhere from 1-3 weeks at a time during those eight times a year give or take. It is not unusual for me to fire those lights 50-200 times a day when I am shooting. But while I do use them on location, and have no hesitation in doing so, the vast majority is done in a studio setting.

In that time I have replaced 2 or 3 modeling light bulbs and one fuse.

Thank you again, what are u shooting when you use them? Do you have a web page or 500px account or somthing? Would be fun to look at.

Since you seem to have a lot of knowledgde around this subject at least more than me since i am still learning.
Reading this from david mr strobist http://strobist.blogspot.no/2011/01/...nie-yezek.html
And seeing the picture_: https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidhobby/5112353781/

He does not say anything but flash duration in the article wich i find odd? But is this possible with the einstein and perhaps a nikon sb900 for fill on low power? Or will the ambient somehow ruin the picture ? Or will the flash still freeze the subject, have only tried this inside, where i can controll the ambient.

[inkista]

Not sure if this comes close to a solution (I don't use studio strobes), but see: Mark Kitaoka's tests/reviews of the Godox AD600. He tests the AD600's capability to freeze motion both in-studio and on-location, as well as generally describing how it performs for professional commercial work. He also has a gallery of dance images he shot with AD600s. Whether you can get them serviced easily (Godox, like Yongnuo, are in Shenzhen China) is a question, but they (and the flash bulb) are pretty much available worldwide (I believe Lencarta and Walimex are rebranding the Godox lights in Europe).

There's also the QT-600 II if you don't need a cordless strobe.

[Loose Canon]

Lars,

I had a look at Mr. Hobby’s photo, then took a walk over to your other link to see if he said how he shot it. Which he did.

He explains the mechanics pretty well as long as one has the basics down on how this all works.

He explains how, when, and why he shot in very low ambient, at and below max sync, how he was (kind of) able to freeze the motion of the dancer, where the motion blur is visible in the shot and why (because of ambient), and how he planned the shoot with a very low level ambient background. So yes, he has some motion blur affecting the shot due to ambient but has minimized the effect by shooting at a particular time of day, and with an eye toward the background, how it is providing the ambient in the frame, and how he dealt with it.

In my opinion, it’s a great shot. And an Einstein and a couple of SB900’s could come close to pulling it off. You might have to gang the speedlights as your fill to get enough power to provide fill but keep the duration short (enough). The Einstein would work nicely as a key light and just as well as one of his Profoto B600’s. He mentioned he used a three light setup with a fill light and a rim light along with a key. You would have to experiment with your available lights to best find what you want to end up with, but the lights are up to the job. You just may not have enough of them to replicate this particular lighting scenario, meaning three light sources. Key, fill, and rim lighting and with enough available power.

Since you asked Lars, here are a couple of shots where I used the Einsteins to stop the action. Not quite the same as you are planning to shoot, but these are kind of up close and personal and I pretty much require dead-on motion stopping and everything in sharp focus and good detail for what I like to see in a photograph of this nature. The shorter the duration you can coax out of your lights, while having enough power to light the scene, the better the chance you can get the “keepers”.

[teigas]

Thank you really coold shots

[teigas]

Thank you for the input, i also watched the godox, but then the price gos up by 2,5x the amount i have to pay for this complete used set. But they where under consideration The one shot with the milky way look a little unatural, could be that he brought her , but yeah :P

Not sure if this comes close to a solution (I don't use studio strobes), but see: Mark Kitaoka's tests/reviews of the Godox AD600. He tests the AD600's capability to freeze motion both in-studio and on-location, as well as generally describing how it performs for professional commercial work. He also has a gallery of dance images he shot with AD600s. Whether you can get them serviced easily (Godox, like Yongnuo, are in Shenzhen China) is a question, but they (and the flash bulb) are pretty much available worldwide (I believe Lencarta and Walimex are rebranding the Godox lights in Europe).

There's also the QT-600 II if you don't need a cordless strobe.