My 90mm Tamron f/2.8 Macro has become erratic

[rpcrowe]

I can no longer depend on my Tamron 90mm f/2.8 AF SP Macro Lens to provide correct exposure when using either my 7D, 7D2 or 5D2 cameras. It was working O.K. with my 30D and 40D cameras. The primary problem is when I am using flash but, that is not the only time the exposure is off. Granted that this is the older version of the Tamron Macro and is NOT the Di version.

I shouldn't really complain. I bought the lens, used, for $90 USD about eight years ago and used it right up until I switched from the 40D to the 7D. A Tamron rep told me that they could not or would not rechip the lens to work with the latest issue cameras.

Even using it in manual exposure mode, it is somewhat erratic and I cannot trust it...

I ended up ordering a used Canon 100mm f/2.8 (non-IS) macro lens to replace the Tamron. I am waiting for it to arrive in the mail...

[Shadowman]

Well at least there's an explanation for the behavior.

[rpcrowe]

I tested out the Tamron on my 7D and 7D2 cameras because I am going to the San Diego Safari Park Butterfly Preserve on Wednesday. Of course, the Canon macro is not going to arrive before then but, I have decided to use my 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II lens for the butterflies. I would guess that a CF card is somewhere near the size of a butterfly. I tried my 100-400mm with a 20mm extension tube (which is the only extension tube that I own) and came up with this shot.

It is pretty amazing, This is at 400mm hand held with IS on. 1/20 second, f/5.6, @ ISO 1600 ambient light at my computer desk. From about 36-inches from the subject. This is a full 1.6x crop image with no cropping in Photoshop...



I can shoot from closer using 100mm and 200mm and also pretty well fill the frame with the CF card.

Tomorrow, I will play with this flash rig for close-up photography using my 100-400 Mk-2 lens on the 7D2 camera...



Actually, shooting with 400mm will allow me to get close-ups of some creepy-crawlies that might be frightened away if I got closer with a camera/lens...

The really neat thing about the 100-400 Mk-2 is that if I have it with me when traveling, I can get "pretty close" without any addition of an extension tube and can really get close with the 20mm extension tube. The 20mm tube weighs less than nothing to carry on a trip...

My next experiment will be to add the 1.4x extender on with the extension tube and see what kind of image that I can get from that combination...

[Manfred M]

Tamron and Sigma are (in)famous for not not supporting old lenses on newer camera models. I wonder if this is what you are running into.

[rpcrowe]

Manfred wrote, "Tamron and Sigma are (in)famous for not not supporting old lenses on newer camera models. I wonder if this is what you are running into."

I think so... I have a 28mm f/2.8 Sigma that I used on my 10D but, can't use on any newer camera. Sigma, will not or cannot (amounts to the same thing) upgrade that lens to work with any camera later than the 10D. I knew that was the case when I purchased that lens and I paid a price accordingly...

There is a silver lining atop that dark cloud. I converted an old Canon D60 (not the "60D") the D60 is the camera issued by Canon between the D30 and the 10D. That camera being a model older than the 10D still works fine with the old Sigma 28mm. Saves me from having a "Sigma Paperweight"

I have heard that Sigma now has a computer connection of some type on their lenses (this is just rumor and since I have never purchased another Sigma lens - I don't know if it is true) to allow you to upgrade the electronics and basically "rechip"the lens electronically to work with newer cameras.

I had an older 400mm Tokina f/5.6 lens that worked with all my cameras through the 40D. I replaced it with the 400mm f/5.6L and then the 100-400 Mk-2. I have used my 12-24mm f/4 Tokina ATX on a 30D, 40D, 7D and a 7D2. I have also used it on my 5D2. Although, it is designed for a crop sensor, it is NOT an EFS lens. It fits on a full frame camera but vignettes at the widest focal lengths. It's still pretty darn wide for a full frame camera at 17-18mm or so where the vignetting seems to just about stop...

[rtbaum]

I tested out the Tamron on my 7D and 7D2 cameras because I am going to the San Diego Safari Park Butterfly Preserve on Wednesday. Of course, the Canon macro is not going to arrive before then but, I have decided to use my 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS II lens for the butterflies. I would guess that a CF card is somewhere near the size of a butterfly. I tried my 100-400mm with a 20mm extension tube (which is the only extension tube that I own) and came up with this shot.

It is pretty amazing, This is at 400mm hand held with IS on. 1/20 second, f/5.6, @ ISO 1600 ambient light at my computer desk. From about 36-inches from the subject. This is a full 1.6x crop image with no cropping in Photoshop...



I can shoot from closer using 100mm and 200mm and also pretty well fill the frame with the CF card.

Tomorrow, I will play with this flash rig for close-up photography using my 100-400 Mk-2 lens on the 7D2 camera...



Actually, shooting with 400mm will allow me to get close-ups of some creepy-crawlies that might be frightened away if I got closer with a camera/lens...

The really neat thing about the 100-400 Mk-2 is that if I have it with me when traveling, I can get "pretty close" without any addition of an extension tube and can really get close with the 20mm extension tube. The 20mm tube weighs less than nothing to carry on a trip...

My next experiment will be to add the 1.4x extender on with the extension tube and see what kind of image that I can get from that combination...

I've actually learned to enjoy doing 'macro' with my 400mm and as you say, it is useful for skittish insects....or lazy photogs

[ragman]

Richard
I have the canon 100mm 2.8 ( non IS) L, and I think you will love it. I love mine.

[rpcrowe]

I think that I got a good buy from eBay on this lens. I got it at a very good price from a seller that has over six-thousand feedbacks with a 99.8% positive rate. It is expected to arrive on March 31st. In the interim, I will shoot the butterfly exhibit using my 100-400 Mk-2.
The reason that it is important to get shoot the butterflies tomorrow and not wait until I receive the 100mm macro lens is that my photo club has arranged to be allowed into the Butterfly exhibit a half hour before the general public. It is a small area and once opened, soon becomes very crowded with the general public getting within six inches of the butterflies using their cell phones and P&S cameras and spoiling many shots.

[george013]

I've never heard of something like this with Nikon. Is this specific Canon?

George

[Manfred M]

I have heard that Sigma now has a computer connection of some type on their lenses (this is just rumor and since I have never purchased another Sigma lens - I don't know if it is true) to allow you to upgrade the electronics and basically "rechip"the lens electronically to work with newer cameras.

This is available on some of the newer lenses and is little more than something that allows the user to upgrade the firmware in the lens itself. The user is still dependent on Sigma to supply the firmware updates. If there are none for the lens / body in question this feature is of little value.

[rpcrowe]

George...

Sigma, and I think Tamron, reverse engineer their lenses by purchasing the latest Canon cameras and modifying their lenses to work with these cameras (if modification is required). However, there comes a time in the life of the lens that it is no longer economically feasible for Sigma/Tamron to support their old lenses and they therefore no longer upgrade these to work with the latest Canon cameras
That is what is meant by the old term "Sigma Lottery" in which you may buy a great lens at a slightly lower price than Canon glass or you might eventually own the proverbial "Sigma Paperweight"
Hopefully, Sigma/Tamron have found their way out of this problem. I don't know since I have never considered a Sigma lens after my first 28mm f/2.8...
As far as Canon EF lenses go, they work forever, even with the new Canon DSLR cameras. I have an EF 135mm f/2.8 (Soft-Focus) lens that was one of the very first auto focus lenses designed for Canon EOS 35mm film cameras. It still works great now on my 7D2. I don't use it very often since most soft-focus effects can now be done in PP...

[george013]

George...

Sigma, and I think Tamron, reverse engineer their lenses by purchasing the latest Canon cameras and modifying their lenses to work with these cameras (if modification is required). However, there comes a time in the life of the lens that it is no longer economically feasible for Sigma/Tamron to support their old lenses and they therefore no longer upgrade these to work with the latest Canon cameras
That is what is meant by the old term "Sigma Lottery" in which you may buy a great lens at a slightly lower price than Canon glass or you might eventually own the proverbial "Sigma Paperweight"
Hopefully, Sigma/Tamron have found their way out of this problem. I don't know since I have never considered a Sigma lens after my first 28mm f/2.8...
As far as Canon EF lenses go, they work forever, even with the new Canon DSLR cameras. I have an EF 135mm f/2.8 (Soft-Focus) lens that was one of the very first auto focus lenses designed for Canon EOS 35mm film cameras. It still works great now on my 7D2. I don't use it very often since most soft-focus effects can now be done in PP...

I just don't understand. If Canon is changing or using different communication protocols, then that would count for their own lenses too I would think.

George

[rpcrowe]

I was playing with my Canon 600D RT flash, my 7D2 camera, and the old Tamron 90mm f/2.8 Macro lens.

I was in my office at night with medium bright (that's a scientific term - didn't you know) overhead lights. The exposure reading at ISO 200, is 1/25 second @ f/2.8.

Testing was done with the flash mounted on the camera hotshoe with the flash depressed. I used a Stofen diffuser straight on...

The camera/lens will expose O.K if I use Programmed mode on the camera and ETTL for the flash. That gives me 1/60 second @ f/8 in normally lit room. However, if I place the camera on manual at 1/60 second at f/8 with the flash on ETTL, the image is over exposed. Even when I dial in up to -3 stops of exposure compensation on the flash.

If I use aperture priority and ETTL, I cannot get a decent exposure, no matter what f/stop I select

I can get a decent exposure with the flash on Manual at 1/64 power and the camera @ f/22 and 1/250 second, I get a decent exposure but this is totally the flash exposure.

[george013]

I was playing with my Canon 600D RT flash, my 7D2 camera, and the old Tamron 90mm f/2.8 Macro lens.

I was in my office at night with medium bright (that's a scientific term - didn't you know) overhead lights. The exposure reading at ISO 200, is 1/25 second @ f/2.8.

Testing was done with the flash mounted on the camera hotshoe with the flash depressed. I used a Stofen diffuser straight on...

The camera/lens will expose O.K if I use Programmed mode on the camera and ETTL for the flash. That gives me 1/60 second @ f/8 in normally lit room. However, if I place the camera on manual at 1/60 second at f/8 with the flash on ETTL, the image is over exposed. Even when I dial in up to -3 stops of exposure compensation on the flash.

If I use aperture priority and ETTL, I cannot get a decent exposure, no matter what f/stop I select

I can get a decent exposure with the flash on Manual at 1/64 power and the camera @ f/22 and 1/250 second, I get a decent exposure but this is totally the flash exposure.

If you want to know if your lens has a failure, keep it as simple as possible: no flash.
Out of my thumb, check the exif, compare all the items that are responsible for the exposure, also the iso settings. And don't forget the EC, set it on 0.
Do the same check again with everything on manual, also the iso and no flash. Check the exif.

I don't believe in something as firmware update. The lens doesn't make decisions, it provides information. If so there would be 2 captains on one ship and that will never work.

George

[DanK]

Great to see what near-macro you can do with your 100-400. I splurged on one a few months ago, in part for that purpose, and once spring finally arrives (despite global warming, we have more snow coming tomorrow), I will hunt for big bugs and try it out.

Re the 100mm: I have the other Canon 100mm macro. The two are supposedly optically very similar in quality. I love the lens. it is a very versatile focal length, and with a 36mm tube, it provides ideal magnification for some bugs, if you can get close enough. (the magnification from any length of extension is roughly inversely proportional to focal length.) My most common bug-hunting rig is that combination. However, my flash rig (I will post a typical version below) doesn't protrude much farther forward than the lens, which I think would make it easier to get close.

A typical rig:



A shot illustrating the magnification with 100mm + 36 mm extension:

[rpcrowe]

Dan.
Thanks for posting this... I have a 40mm extension tube (the only one that I have and I don't know the brand). It is nice to see the magnification that I could expect using that tube with my coming 100mm Canon macro lens. It does have electronic connections through to the camera for TTL or for autofocus...

My macro flash outfit is very much like the one you use (see the third post in this series). However, when shooting in close quarters or in windy conditions, it is not the perfect solution. I would have had a hard time shooting in the crowded conditions of the butterfly exhibit so I have seriously considered a ring flash.

Yongnuo makes a ring flash (YN-14EX-C) that seems to be just about what I am looking for.

First is the price: under $100 USD
Second: TTL and manual exposure
Third: You can adjust each side of the ring light flash to avoid completely flat images
Fourth: LED focus light

The downside is that the light is not very powerful but, I will only be using it for macro from a close distance.

One reviewer stated that downsides are no HSS and no master or slave capability. I don't like to use ring lights for anything but macro shots - so those drawbacks do not bother me...

I could just leave the ring light on the lens so when I see some macro opportunity, I don't have to do a lot of setup...

[DanK]

Richard,

Thanks for posting about the YN=14EX-C. I have always avoided ring lights because of the flat lighting, but the fact that you can set the two sides of this one at different levels might take care of that. I can get it even cheaper via a contract with my university, so there isn't a great deal of downside. Like you, I don't care about HSS or slave/master, since neither is relevant to macro work.

If you are going to try this, I may wait and see what your experience is. The way the weather has been here this spring--we are expecting a major snowstorm starting this afternoon--I won't be chasing bugs for a while.

Dan

[kazuyar]

my sigma 105 macro lens worked fine on my D90 but not on my D7000, the lens was about 7 years old, i contacted sigma and they offered to flash the lens for free, they even paid all postage

[rpcrowe]

Richard,

Thanks for posting about the YN=14EX-C. I have always avoided ring lights because of the flat lighting, but the fact that you can set the two sides of this one at different levels might take care of that. I can get it even cheaper via a contract with my university, so there isn't a great deal of downside. Like you, I don't care about HSS or slave/master, since neither is relevant to macro work.

If you are going to try this, I may wait and see what your experience is. The way the weather has been here this spring--we are expecting a major snowstorm starting this afternoon--I won't be chasing bugs for a while.

Dan

I ordered the Yongnuo YN=14EX-C from an eBay vender but then realized that it is available from B&H in New York City. That should not be a problem except that I would have received it earlier from B&H. It will be about a week before the light gets here.

One advantage to the ring light over my combination that I posted above is that I can carry the rig basically set up in my camera bag, so I don't have to spend time at my destination setting up the rig or having to carry the rig without the bag. When I visit the butterfly enclosure, it is imperative for me to carry the camera/lens in a camera bag since it is relatively cool in the early morning (Park opens at 8:30 AM) ans it is hot and moist in the exhibit. If I have carried my camera over my shoulder without a bag, the lens will fog up...

Kaz...

To my knowledge, Sigma will rechip a lens if it is a current model but will not rechip the lens if they have brought out a new model of the lens in question...

[rpcrowe]

I just received the used Canon 100mm f/2.8 (non-L) lens that I purchased from eBay. It arrived on time and was very clean and devoid of dings and scratches. My first quickie shot looks like it focuses and exposes O.K.



I shot this African Daisy using fill flash. That was the nemesis of my older 90mm f/2.8 AS SP Macro (non-Di) lens. Exposure, especially with flash was erratic and generally too light. I couldn't get consistent exposures even when shooting in manual mode - especially with fill flash. That indicates to me that the lens was not stopping down to the shooting aperture with any regularity.

My "new" used macro lens cost me just $250 USD including shipping.

I really didn't want to spend the extra money for the Canon f/2.8L macro...