Long Lens Landscape

[pnodrog]

George the mathematics is very simple and easily understood. (For a given viewpoint no maths at all )

It is understanding our response of the perceived change in relationship that I find more interesting and is key to us developing as photographers.

[george013]

George the mathematics is very simple and easily understood. (For a given viewpoint no maths at all )

It is understanding our response of the perceived change in relationship that I find more interesting and is key to us developing as photographers.

It's difficult for me to know if my thoughts and mathematics are understood. Mostly it starts to become a yes/no discussion with one or two persons.

When I understand your remark well, is when does that mathematical behavior results in a non natural look.

On the first hand I don't think it's angle related. I just tried, without a measure lint, but my minimal looking distance is about 30cm. At what distance do we start to talk about wa distortion?
The long length picture is in the short length picture. It's only enlarged so it becomes vissible. I just wonder if the whole picture would be enlarged, keeping the framing of that 18mmDX, so that the details of the 170mmDX would be vissible, if I had that feeling also.

George

[Davejl]

I like this. Great deatil in the mountain, though on my iPad the lower land looks maybe just a bit dark. The telephoto approach works well. Even though our mountains are of fairly modest height, they often seem higher somehow, and your scene conveys this. (I've only seen Suilven through the murk from near Knockan Crag, I think it was).

[johnlarsen]

You definitely proved your point there Donald. But even though I am a big fan of breaking rules, I wonder if having the far mountain more away from the center would make me feel better. That would also give us a look into the 'far away'


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[pnodrog]

It's difficult for me to know if my thoughts and mathematics are understood. Mostly it starts to become a yes/no discussion with one or two persons.

When I understand your remark well, is when does that mathematical behavior results in a non natural look.

On the first hand I don't think it's angle related. I just tried, without a measure lint, but my minimal looking distance is about 30cm. At what distance do we start to talk about wa distortion?
The long length picture is in the short length picture. It's only enlarged so it becomes vissible. I just wonder if the whole picture would be enlarged, keeping the framing of that 18mmDX, so that the details of the 170mmDX would be vissible, if I had that feeling also.

George

George I scanned through my photographs looking for one suitable to use as a reference sample. However I did not find one that I felt was suitable to illustrate my point. It will be a good excuse and exercise for me to go out and take one specially to do so. Depending on the weather I will try and take one this weekend. I will start a new thread as this one should remain about Donald's mountain scene.

[Donald]

You definitely proved your point there Donald. But even though I am a big fan of breaking rules, I wonder if having the far mountain more away from the center would make me feel better. That would also give us a look into the 'far away'

Thanks, John.

It is all a matter of personal preference in terms of composition. This is what worked for me.

One of the things about using a square format is, as many commentators and teachers will tell you, that the 'rules' as in 'Rule of Thirds' etc., don't apply.

[DanK]

Neither wide angle "distortion" or long focal length "compression" are particularly good terms to use to describe what is happening. The underling cause is that human vision and our resulting perception of what looks normal is based on our own angle of view which is about 50 to 60 degrees. Eye movement will widen it to about 70 degrees and our preferred zone down to about 30 deg. Any lens angle greater or less than these angles may to some extent make the image look unnatural. It is not due to any trick or fault of the optics. It is just a result of our perception.

once again, I don't see where the disagreement is. I didn't say that there is a fault or trick of the optics, and I said nothing about distortion. What I wrote is that the effect of narrower AOV is to create an impression of compression because of how we perceive objects, which I think is the same thing you wrote, just in different words.

The definition of "compression" by Merriam Webster mirrors common usage: "to press or squeeze together." I think that is why many people (including me) use compression to refer to the impression created by a narrow AOV: it makes near and far things seem like they have been pushed together. Unfortunately, I don't know of any common term that describes well the opposite: the effect of widening the AOV.

[pnodrog]

once again, I don't see where the disagreement is. I didn't say that there is a fault or trick of the optics, and I said nothing about distortion. What I wrote is that the effect of narrower AOV is to create an impression of compression because of how we perceive objects, which I think is the same thing you wrote, just in different words.

The definition of "compression" by Merriam Webster mirrors common usage: "to press or squeeze together." I think that is why many people (including me) use compression to refer to the impression created by a narrow AOV: it makes near and far things seem like they have been pushed together. Unfortunately, I don't know of any common term that describes well the opposite: the effect of widening the AOV.

Dan, I was not meaning to particularly disagree with anyone but just trying to expand the explanations so that the true culprit (our visual memory) was brought into the discussion. Who cares what a scene would look like when taken from another viewpoint with a different lens? What really matters is how we mentally process the image. It is a response to crop not to lens. I am sure we agree thinking that the lens has caused the compression is wrong. It does not matter what focal length lens is used they will all record the same perspective.

As you say AOV is the technical part of the issue.

[DanK]

Paul,

thanks. I understand now what you are saying.

Dan