Suggestions for photographing Birds in Flight

[LuisLB]

Hi,
This is my first post on Cambridge in Colour. I purchased a Sony 70-400 mm f4-5.6 g ssm ii to use with my Sony a77ii camera. The lens is incredibly sharp -- and from my perspective, very bulky and heavy. I've taken several pictures using a tripod with good results. But I'm wondering about hand holding techniques. I would like to take pictures of birds in flight at seaside marshlands and bird refuges. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

[Shadowman]

Luis,

I've tried this technique for handholding, however birds can be very erratic so may not work with some species.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDsx3-FWfwk

[pschlute]

Consider a monopod. Halfway house that gives stability yet not so bulky as a tripod.

[LuisLB]

Shadowman:
Thanks so much for the link. I'll watch the video and try out the suggested techniques in the next couple of days.
LuisLB

[LuisLB]

Peter:
Thanks for the suggestion. I will begin my search for a monopod asap.
LuisLB

[William W]

Consider a monopod. Halfway house that gives stability yet not so bulky as a tripod.

+1.

I don't do BIF, but I do a lot of Sport with big Lenses; any lens around 300/2.8, or longer is on a Monopod.

Does the Sony Lens have a Tripod Collar? The most flexible technique and the technique almost universally adopted by Sports' Photographers is to attach the Monopod directly to the Lens's Tripod Collar (i.e. NOT USING a Monopod Head.) Most Sports work has the Camera Elevation at Subject Level or slightly above: I see no problem reversing that situation and shooting upwards, provided that the Monopod's extension allows; possibly in some scenarios you could shoot seated.

I know some BIFers who use a Tripod and Gimbal Head: personally that idea doesn't float my boat. I avoid carrying a Tripod if I can.

***

I expect that the lens appears 'heavy' now: you haven't used it much. Surprisingly you might find that it will appear lighter and more easily manoeuvrable and I would encourage you to attempt Hand Held now and again.

I expect that using the lens first up, the muscles that you need to use and the way you need them to achieve that is a new experience for your body, with practice and good technique, the body will generally warm to new ideas.

***

On technique - one of the most horrible fatigue creating techniques (no matter what lens or camera) is to hold the camera poised ready to shoot and you 'cocked' for extended periods; the more free movement and the more relaxed the whole body is generally, then the quicker and more efficient you'll get the camera to the eye and the body in position to release the shutter, and the day will not be as fatiguing for you: this is so for Hand Holding and also using a Monopod.

WW

[george013]

+1.

I don't do BIF, but I do a lot of Sport with big Lenses; any lens around 300/2.8, or longer is on a Monopod.

Does the Sony Lens have a Tripod Collar? The most flexible technique and the technique almost universally adopted by Sports' Photographers is to attach the Monopod directly to the Lens's Tripod Collar (i.e. NOT USING a Monopod Head.) Most Sports work has the Camera Elevation at Subject Level or slightly above: I see no problem reversing that situation and shooting upwards, provided that the Monopod's extension allows; possibly in some scenarios you could shoot seated.

I know some BIFers who use a Tripod and Gimbal Head: personally that idea doesn't float my boat. I avoid carrying a Tripod if I can.

***

I expect that the lens appears 'heavy' now: you haven't used it much. Surprisingly you might find that it will appear lighter and more easily manoeuvrable and I would encourage you to attempt Hand Held now and again.

I expect that using the lens first up, the muscles that you need to use and the way you need them to achieve that is a new experience for your body, with practice and good technique, the body will generally warm to new ideas.

***

On technique - one of the most horrible fatigue creating techniques (no matter what lens or camera) is to hold the camera poised ready to shoot and you 'cocked' for extended periods; the more free movement and the more relaxed the whole body is generally, then the quicker and more efficient you'll get the camera to the eye and the body in position to release the shutter, and the day will not be as fatiguing for you: this is so for Hand Holding and also using a Monopod.

WW

I have a monopod and first used it directly connected to the camera/tripod collar. Always when moving on I did unscrew it. I bought a ballhead with quick release for that. It gives you much more freedom also in aiming: the tripod can stay vertical what is the most stable position.

Louis,
In general it can be said to move your left hand as much as possible to the front, within practical limits off course. A small movement with your left hand close to the camera will have more impact as that same movement far from the camera.

George

[russellsnr]

Hi, Have a look at https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCpg...JbJ0iTA/videos there is loads of info on all aspects of bird photography or here https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCT4...leQ1amg/videos again loads of info. Just getting into bird photography and learned a lot from both these guys. Russ.

[Acorn]

I always use a tripod in combination with a gimbal and also use back-button focusing. If you happen to be in a hide where a tripod might be impractical, then a bean bag often proves useful. When I'm shooting from within my car I have adapted a piece of foam pipe lagging to fit over the edge of a lowered window.

[William W]

I have a monopod and first used it directly connected to the camera/tripod collar. Always when moving on I did unscrew it. I bought a ballhead with quick release for that. It gives you much more freedom also in aiming: the tripod [don't you mean 'monopod'???]can stay vertical what is the most stable position.

I understand that from your experience, your opinion is that a Ball Head on a vertical Monopod, (obviously the Ball Head is loose so you can tilt and drop to track action) with an heavy lens on top of that rig is "the most stable position".

Based upon my experience, that is not my opinion.

Additionally, as I see the theory of it, the rig you describe is akin to having a wobbly weight attached to a loose elbow joint then attached to a long stick in the ground - very floppy. How do you keep the Monopod 'vertical' with that floppy elbow joint between the Monopod and the big heavy lens?

On the other hand, my experience is a good quality, stable Monopod, firmly planted in/on the ground, (with suitable footing) with the Lens's Tripod Collar directly attached to the Monopod, not only allows a very heavy rig to be panned quickly, moreover, it allows the Lens to be tilted and dropped to angles a bit less than 45 degrees from the horizontal, I have found 30 degrees is usually very easy. One foot at the base (in front or behind) of the Monopod is good technique to firm up the footing. All the pan, tilt and drop movements are achieved in an exceptionally stable manner.

One key point about best practice Monopod technique, especially with long and/or heavy lenses, is to have the left hand at the front end of the lens: one (not the only) key reason is to create a well balanced see-saw action for efficient and quick Tilt and Drop of the Lens and thus be able to track and vertical movement of the Subject/Object.

For the Tilt and Drop action of the Lens to be anywhere near efficient, the "pole" (i.e. Monopod) between the ground point and the Lens's connection to the pole, must be rigid: that rigidity implies, in fact demands, that the Monopod's angle to the ground changes as the camera is tilted or dropped.

The alternative, as you suggest, is to somehow keep the Monopod vertical at all times and tilt and drop the Lens via a loose joint at the base of the lens.

As I mentioned, I don't do BIF, and I would always default to those who do.

And as I mentioned, of those whom I do know, some use a Tripod and Gimbal . . .[(and many use Hand Held, which I didn't mention because the OP is asking about NOT hand held)]. . .

EDIT made on 15.03 2019 - should have read: "and many use hand held - which I mentioned later when talking about technique and fatigue"

Importantly, pusuent to this conversation the remainder do use a Monopod: and use it as I have described. There is one fellow I know who does use a Ball Head - and it is locked solid (really SOLID), so effectively he uses the Monopod as I described. (He prefers the QRP Plate set up on that particular Ball Head, which he also uses on his Tripod - and it is a super expensive, heavy duty Ball Head).

Additionally, IME, it is much easier to leave the lens and camera on the Monopod when carrying it.

But if one wants to switch between the camera/lens which is on Monopod, or if one want to remove the camera and lens for carrying there are QRP that can attach directly to the top of the Monopod's Top Plate, there's no need to introduce a Ball Head for that purpose.

WW

[rpcrowe]

I totally agree that a monopod is a handy item to have when using a heavy lens.

Different folks use their monopods in different ways. I personally like to keep my pod perpendicular to the ground, right under the camera.

I don't use a ball head on my monopod. Instead, I most often use a monopod tilt swivel to allow me to elevate the camera while still keeping the pod at a 90 degree angle to the ground. I normally keep the swivel fairly loose when actually shooing and only tighten it when I carry the rig with the lens resting on my shoulder. There are many monopod swivels available from B&H, Adorama or eBay at different prices. I would make sure that the swivel I use is of good enough quality to safely support my camera/lens.

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...vel&_sacat=625

Whether or not you use a swivel between your camera and the monopod, I strongly suggest using some sort of a quick release system. That way you can take the camera off the monopod and place it back on with the least amount of work. I personally use an Arca Compatible clamp as my quick release system. However if you use the Manfrotto Q.R. RC-2 Q.R. system you can find swivels for that type of plate.

The problem with taking the camera off the monopod is what to do with the pod when it is disconnected from the camera. Holding it in your hand is really not a great option and putting it on the ground can be hazardous due to possible mud and sand, I really like this cheap belt loupe carrier.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Fixed-P...wAAOSwFZZcGgxN

This belt loupe is really dual purpose. You can place the tip of the partially collapsed monopod in the pouch and you have a very flexible way to use your monopod if you need to move around. It stabilizes the camera/lens but allows you to move around and to point the camera in various directions.

[george013]

I understand that from your experience, your opinion is that a Ball Head on a vertical Monopod, (obviously the Ball Head is loose so you can tilt and drop to track action) with an heavy lens on top of that rig is "the most stable position".

Based upon my experience, that is not my opinion.

Additionally, as I see the theory of it, the rig you describe is akin to having a wobbly weight attached to a loose elbow joint then attached to a long stick in the ground - very floppy. How do you keep the Monopod 'vertical' with that floppy elbow joint between the Monopod and the big heavy lens?

On the other hand, my experience is a good quality, stable Monopod, firmly planted in/on the ground, (with suitable footing) with the Lens's Tripod Collar directly attached to the Monopod, not only allows a very heavy rig to be panned quickly, moreover, it allows the Lens to be tilted and dropped to angles a bit less than 45 degrees from the horizontal, I have found 30 degrees is usually very easy. One foot at the base (in front or behind) of the Monopod is good technique to firm up the footing. All the pan, tilt and drop movements are achieved in an exceptionally stable manner.

One key point about best practice Monopod technique, especially with long and/or heavy lenses, is to have the left hand at the front end of the lens: one (not the only) key reason is to create a well balanced see-saw action for efficient and quick Tilt and Drop of the Lens and thus be able to track and vertical movement of the Subject/Object.

For the Tilt and Drop action of the Lens to be anywhere near efficient, the "pole" (i.e. Monopod) between the ground point and the Lens's connection to the pole, must be rigid: that rigidity implies, in fact demands, that the Monopod's angle to the ground changes as the camera is tilted or dropped.

The alternative, as you suggest, is to somehow keep the Monopod vertical at all times and tilt and drop the Lens via a loose joint at the base of the lens.

As I mentioned, I don't do BIF, and I would always default to those who do.

And as I mentioned, of those whom I do know, some use a Tripod and Gimbal (and many use Hand Held, which I didn't mention because the OP is asking about NOT hand held).

Importantly, pusuent to this conversation the remainder do use a Monopod: and use it as I have described. There is one fellow I know who does use a Ball Head - and it is locked solid (really SOLID), so effectively he uses the Monopod as I described. (He prefers the QRP Plate set up on that particular Ball Head, which he also uses on his Tripod - and it is a super expensive, heavy duty Ball Head).

Additionally, IME, it is much easier to leave the lens and camera on the Monopod when carrying it.

But if one wants to switch between the camera/lens which is on Monopod, or if one want to remove the camera and lens for carrying there are QRP that can attach directly to the top of the Monopod's Top Plate, there's no need to introduce a Ball Head for that purpose.

WW

I must correct myself, I only used a quick release plate. And off course I meant monopod. And I don't think it's easier to walk with monopod attached to the camera/lens. Depending on the camera off course.

I don't think you can do birds in flight photography with a star combination monopod and camera/lens. Low flying birds will be no problem but as soon they fly higher it will. Assume you go as low as 45 degrees as you said. I'm high 1.80m. So let's say the viewer is 1.80m. I can look straight through the viewer. When I go down 45 degrees I must not only go down to 1.27 but even more for my head,big, must be under the camera and I've to move my head up while my body is going forwards. At the same time I've also to step backwards 1.27m. When I want to make a turn to follow a overflying bird I must make a circle of 1.27m radius, 2.54m diagonal.
Further the monopod has to carry the weight. That force is transported through that monopod. Vertical that force is 100% to the ground. When lowering in an angle that force is divided in a horizontal and a vertical force. The horizontal force causing the monopod to slib away at a certain moment.
A vertical monopod is eliminating vertical movements. By lowering the camera you not only have to take over some weight of the camera, but also introduce vertical movements.

I must admit theoretical. On the tripod I've a ballhead. When using it on moving objects/sport always loose.

George

[Cantab]

Luis, there have been several threads in the past on birds in flight. One in particular had very useful advice by someone who had real expertise in bird photography.

It may be possible to find these threads by using the search function on this forum but it is not always the easiest tool for zeroing in on relevant threads. I'll dig around in my paper file of CiC advice on birds in flight and hopefully be able to post links to relevant threads later today.

[William W]

. . . I don't think you can do birds in flight photography with a star combination monopod and camera/lens. Low flying birds will be no problem but as soon they fly higher it will. . .

Agree.

As the angle increases so do the problems increase. I expect that the fellows I know who use a Monopod don't get to 45 degrees much, probably never: their images seem that they rarely get to about 20 degrees. My example was that I need to get to 30 degrees and do that with no problem. Obviously, a Tripod and Gimbal or Hand Held have advantages when shooting upward at increased angles. And both have disadvantages, too.

WW

[William W]

I want to re-iterate all my comments refer to mounting the LENS on the Monopod (via the Len's Tripod Collar) and not mounting the Camera on the Monopod.

WW

[george013]

I want to re-iterate all my comments refer to mounting the LENS on the Monopod (via the Len's Tripod Collar) and not mounting the Camera on the Monopod.

WW

The only difference is that in this case you have to lower more.

Everybody is developing his own habits.

George

[Cantab]

Luis, this post follows up on my post earlier today. I've now had a look in my paper and electronic BIF files.

As a starting point, I strongly recommend you focus on what a past active member of CiC has said he uses. In the following thread (post 1) he gives a summary of advice which he had provided previously dotted around in a number of other threads: Birds In Flight... My Way . Although Joe has not been active on CiC since 2016, his CiC profile has a link to Joe's Smugmug website; it will give you a good impression of the quality of his bird photography: https://amazinglight.smugmug.com/Galleries/Birds/ .

I'm not sure whether Joe actually says it in so many words, but it seems clear that much of his birds in flight photography is handheld. This is of course assisted by the high shutter speed he uses – a shutter speed that's needed in any event in order to freeze the motion of flying/flapping birds.

In a somewhat earlier post from 2013, Joe also provided comment on his approach to BIF photography: Birds: studying how to shoot (see post #19).

Although I suggest you focus primarily on Joe's comments, you may also find the discussion in the following thread to be of interest: So close but not quite sharp. Please help me identify the issue. .

I also discovered in my files a reference to this article. I have not looked at it closely and cannot comment one way or the other for its quality or usefulness: https://photonaturalist.com/how-to-g...rds-in-flight/ .

I hope this helps.

[William W]

want to re-iterate all my comments refer to mounting the LENS on the Monopod (via the Len's Tripod Collar) and not mounting the Camera on the Monopod.

. . .The only difference is that in this case you have to lower more . . .

That's incorrect. The main difference is the better BALANCE of the rig on the monopod.

The OP specifically cited the lens as "bulky and heavy".

WW

[Polar01]

If you mount the camera to the head, that will lead to the weight of the lens supported by the cameras' body supporting that bulky and heavy lens. Best thing to do is use the lens collar to mount it.

Cheers: Al

[rpcrowe]

In actuality, when shooting aircraft in flight, I use the Canon 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS ii lens. The Image stabilization on this lens is so good that I very often don't use a monopod. I can hand hold this lens very adequately especially when using higher shutter speed which I can easily do when selecting an ISO around ISO 400. This was shot hand held with my 7D Mark II at 1/1,250 second @ f/10 using the 100-400 lens at 320mm...



When I use a monopod, I don't use a ball head, I use a swivel head which is not wobbly because it only swivels fore and aft. I always have the lens attached at the tripod ring which balances the unit better.

If I am in a situation in which I don't need much mobility I prefer to sit when shooting. I have a Cane/Chair that is very easy to use and which helps make my hand-hold quite steady.


Sitting lower also helps when using a monopod because I don't have the pod extended as long. It is sometimes hard to get a shot of a high angle bird or plane when standing with a monopod...