Inflated Photoshop File Sizes

[billtils]

I recently added Photoshop to my bag of PP software. The reason was to use its composite editing tools but of course I looked at other things too ...

Playing with new toys is always fun and I was generally happy until I tried to export a simple edit as a JPEG with long edge of 1400px and a desired resulting file size of around 500KB - something I have done countless times from Capture One and Affinity Photo without any problems.

The steps were: exported** a NEF original as a DNG file (no real reason other than the whimsical thought that the process may as well start in Adobe land). Opened in PS, file size jumped from 29 to 48MB. Added layers for dodge and burn, vibrance and a coupe of curves adjustments and ended up with a 170MB file. Exported as JPEG, long edge 1400px, Quality 60% and ended up with a 2.8MB file.

I hope I'm either doing something incorrectly or there is something I have missed in the various versions of "Dummies guide to PS"...

Thanks in advance.

** for anyone who is wondering about the starting place, I am keeping CaptureOne as my DAM and basic editor and will not be moving these functions to LR (I have tried it out 4 times in the last 2 years; unlike PS it has nothing to offer me).

[Manfred M]

Pixel based editors can create giant files; so this is not an issue that is exclusive to Photoshop. I have some files that are around 2GB.

When I tested Affinity and did complex edits, file sizes were around the same as Photoshop. Capture One, like Lightroom, is a parametric editor where the parameters used in the edits are stored. In pixel based editors, each layer of information is stored, so if you have several layers of pixels, the file size can get quite large.

That being said, hard disk storage is cheap, so file size is not at issue for me. If you store native Photoshop .psd files they are huge. The same goes for .TIF files. Save them as JPEG and you will get some significant space savings as you go from 16-bit raw data to 8-bit JPEG.

[Geoff F]

It certainly looks as though you have something wrong there.

Yes, DNG is more compressed than many lossless file systems so I convert all my keeping quality Raw files to DNG for long term storage to enable me to return to them in the future.

I normally save my completed edits as Psd, which is a bit smaller than Tiff etc. Then, for internet use etc, I resize to 1200 (sometimes 1400) pixels at 80% Jpeg which produces files around 400 to 500 KB.

You mentioned Export . . . Maybe this is your problem. The export control options with PS are somewhat complicated so I just use Save As then set the required Jpeg option when the size box appears. This works much easier for me; unless there is a specific reason to struggle through the Export commands.

Have a try with that method and see what file sizes you obtain. If they are much smaller you can then have a more detailed look through the Export settings to work out where you are doing something not required.

[xpatUSA]

The steps were: exported** a NEF original as a DNG file (no real reason other than the whimsical thought that the process may as well start in Adobe land). Opened in PS, file size jumped from 29 to 48MB. Added layers for dodge and burn, vibrance and a coupe of curves adjustments and ended up with a 170MB file. Exported as JPEG, long edge 1400px, Quality 60% and ended up with a 2.8MB file.

I hope I'm either doing something incorrectly or there is something I have missed in the various versions of "Dummies guide to PS"...

I know next to nothing about PS but the Adobe DNG spec allows several size-swelling options:

1) Adding the original NEF raw data in addition to Adobe's bastardized version (sorry Adobe fans) of that raw data.
2) Adding in a full-size JPEG for viewers.
3) Adding lots of Adobe XMP stuff.

Personally, Bill, I would cut the DNG step out of the workflow.

[billtils]

I normally save my completed edits as Psd, which is a bit smaller than Tiff etc. Then, for internet use etc, I resize to 1200 (sometimes 1400) pixels at 80% Jpeg which produces files around 400 to 500 KB.

Thanks Geoff - that fixed it! Affinity Photo and Capture One don't require a separate resize step and that's what caught me out.

[billtils]

When I tested Affinity and did complex edits, file sizes were around the same as Photoshop.

Indeed they are Manfred but I can go from the final edited image to something that meets the UK requirements for PDI files in one step in AP. I had not been aware of the need for the additional resize step in PS until Geoff pointed it out in his response.

[billtils]

I know next to nothing about PS but the Adobe DNG spec allows several size-swelling options:
Personally, Bill, I would cut the DNG step out of the workflow.

Indeed it does Ted - an extra unwanted and un-needed 19MB in the example. However the DNG doesn't matter - I've had no issues starting with the original NEFs; apart from "whimsical" the only reason for starting with a DNG file is that I thought it may skip the ACR step and let me get straight to the edits but as it happens it doesn't, and I rather like the functionality of the ACR step and find it a net positive in the workflow.

[DanK]

the only reason for starting with a DNG file is that I thought it may skip the ACR step and let me get straight to the edits but as it happens it doesn't,

That's because DNG is a type of raw file, and it has to be converted before Photoshop can deal with it.

When you export a JPEG, the dialog asks you to select a quality level If you leave it at 100%, the size will be relatively large. For displaying on the web, you can reduce the quality a modest amount without visible effects and save space. Here is something explaining this, but with Lightroom's scale: http://regex.info/blog/lightroom-goodies/jpeg-quality.

Re saving as a JPEG: that makes it impossible to redo any edits, as well as throwing out data. If you are certain that you don't want to revise any edits, you can flatten the image and save it either as a PSD or TIFF. That will be much larger than a JPEG, but much smaller than what you have now, and it at least preserves all of the data.

[Manfred M]

Indeed they are Manfred but I can go from the final edited image to something that meets the UK requirements for PDI files in one step in AP. I had not been aware of the need for the additional resize step in PS until Geoff pointed it out in his response.

Don't forget that the market for Photoshop is both graphic artists and high end photographic users, so they want TOTAL control over their images. This gets right down to which method I choose when I resample the images when I upsize and downsize, so automating that is something I would tend to frown on. This is especially the case when I prepare an image for printing.

So yes, you can do what you wish by either taking the extra step and resizing your images or you could use an Action to automate the process. Not quite as simple as what you are used to, but not overly complex either.

I find that the output to a DNG file from another piece of software like Capture One is not particularly useful as it is not truly a raw file. You can re-edit it in a parametric editor, but I have never found a really good reason to do so.

[billtils]

If you are certain that you don't want to revise any edits, you can flatten the image and save it either as a PSD or TIFF. That will be much larger than a JPEG, but much smaller than what you have now, and it at least preserves all of the data.

Thanks Dan. Being able to save a JPEG version of the edits with the file and image sizes mentioned matters as all three of these are UK-wide standards for competition entries and are also a good compromise for sharing with family and friends. I don't do a lot of re-visiting but when I do the starting point is usually the original NEF so throwing out data is not a serious issue.

[billtils]

... you could use an Action to automate the process. Not quite as simple as what you are used to, but not overly complex either. I find that the output to a DNG file from another piece of software like Capture One is not particularly useful ...

Manfred, Thanks for bringing up using an Action - I hadn't thought of that. "DNG" is not an issue - it made a guest appearance in this story and is not part of my existing or planned workflow.