The Falls

[SpiderBob]

After my last picture, I'm trying to pick a title to reinforce what I'm showing. However, in this case I hoping to capture more of the colors of the walls than just the falls, and "The Walls" lost over "The Falls"
Palouse Falls 2019-7723 by Robert Ruby, on Flickr

[SpiderBob]

I feel this is quite an improvement of the first.
Palouse Falls 2- 2019-7723 by Robert Ruby, on Flickr

[Manfred M]

My initial reaction (and the histogram confirms this) is that the image appears to be over-exposed.

[Wavelength]

I too felt that the image is overexposed, because i had a tendency to withdraw; i liked your edit with more details in the falling water.

[SpiderBob]

Thank you gentlemen, I do want more detail, Manfred, your suggestion also darkens the image detail, which I'm trying to bring out more. Perhaps again, there is something I can do and still get the results within limits of the histogram? I'll work on this.

[DanK]

I don't think overexposure is the main problem, although it is overexposed. The main problem is a lack of tonal variation and contrast. This was true of your railroad photo also and points the importance of processing.

Look at the histogram of your version:



First, you will see overexposure: the histogram hits the right end, meaning that some areas are clipped. A correct exposure does not pile pixels up at either end. This clipping loses detail, although with a raw file, one can usually recover detail from clipping that this this minor.

Second, you will see that the mass of pixels does not extend the whole width of the histogram, apart from a tiny tail on the left. This means that you have a limited tonal range, which is one reason the image looks somewhat flat and drab--lacking "pop".

I did three quick edits to illustrate this. First, I pulled the highlights down a little, using the shadow/highlights adjustment in Photoshop. Second, I raised the black point using a levels adjustment. Third, I added a very small amount of mid-tone contrast with a curve. This is the result:



After these global adjustments, I might make some local ones. For example, if this makes some areas of the rock darker than you want, you could dodge those areas to lighten them up.

[Manfred M]

I don't think overexposure is the main problem, although it is overexposed. The main problem is a lack of tonal variation and contrast. This was true of your railroad photo also and points the importance of processing.

Agreed Dan and in fact the image that I posted corrected the white point (and with it global contrast), mid-point and mid-tone contrast. I also made some small colour tweaks by reducing the saturation in the red channel a touch. I did not get into dodging and burning; just global and some area adjustments.


Bob - at this point I'm still trying to understand your overall photographic knowledge and skill level, so am trying to go with "baby steps" in improving the images that you have taken. This covers both the technical sides (as we are discussing here) and the compositional side (which we covered in another posted image).

[SpiderBob]

Thank you for your tutorials, especially the visuals. They are very much appreciated. This is the reason I wanted to get back on this site, knowledgable people willing to give meaningful explanations. Now to get back and apply these skills.
Thank you

[lovelife65]

Nice photo, like Dan's edits. I see you are in Kennewick (we spent a year on the hot side for my job with the USDA at the Tyson Plant in Wallula... I admit I like the West Side better .

Is this Palouse Falls?

[SpiderBob]

Yes it is Palouse Falls, we prefer the hot side over the west side But we do visit there a lot, totally two different picture styles. We just went to Moulton Falls last week, I should put some of those up, after I work with them.

Nice photo, like Dan's edits. I see you are in Kennewick (we spent a year on the hot side for my job with the USDA at the Tyson Plant in Wallula... I admit I like the West Side better .

Is this Palouse Falls?

[lovelife65]

Yes it is Palouse Falls, we prefer the hot side over the west side But we do visit there a lot, totally two different picture styles. We just went to Moulton Falls last week, I should put some of those up, after I work with them.

Yes sir, you should!!

[xpatUSA]

Looking at the Falls, also your later Bridge and recalling the Railroad Tracks there appear to be common factors in all three shots:

1) Lack of contrast giving a hazy look.
2) Reduced saturation, perhaps due to 1) above.
3) Low gradation giving almost an appearance of brush strokes rather than detail; or a limited number of colors giving posterization.

[edit] I just created a hue map of the greenery at camera left of the falls. Lack of color gradation in the form of posterization is plainly evident. [/edit]

I cannot help but feel that you are repeating a certain workflow for these woodland scenes and perhaps you should review your whole process - beginning with the in-camera settings ...

[SpiderBob]

Thank you, yes you are right, I do agree with you. I do not have Photoshop but I do have Lightroom, as that is what I'm working with. I'll go over all of them and follow your suggestions.

[rpcrowe]

We have a great tool at our disposal when shooting with digital cameras (most of them anyway) and that is exposure bracketing. Yet somehow, many photographers seem to look down their noses at this feature. Exposure bracketing will solve many problems having to do with exposure.

Bracketing is something that National Geographic Photographers did frequently when shooting with Kodachrome at ASA 25 which had little or no leeway in exposure.

I will admit that I don't use bracketed exposure all that often because of the accurate metering and extended dynamic range of DSLR and Mirrorless cameras but, it does come in handy at times.

Additionally, if a tripod or other steady support is used, bracketed exposures can be incorporated into an HDR image...

[DanK]

Richard,

Look at the histogram. I don’t see how exposure bracketing would help with this shot because the tonal variation doesn’t extend the full width of the histogram.

Dan


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[xpatUSA]

Richard,

Look at the histogram. I don’t see how exposure bracketing would help with this shot because the tonal variation doesn’t extend the full width of the histogram.

I'm confused: Do we now have access to a bracketed raw histogram e.g. three or five histograms, assuming they exist which we know they don't?

By which I mean that the tonal variation in the histogram of the post-processed image does not necessarily represent the exposure of the original raw shot.

I view my Sigma's captures in RawDigger's raw histograms a lot, so as to weed out the baddies. They rarely resemble converted and post-processed RGB images.

[DanK]

That’s true. But if the editing was relatively minor, the histogram would be close. In addition, basic editing rarely compresses a histogram. So I don’t see any indication of the excessive dynamic range that would call for bracketing. Not that it’s impossible, but I think it’s not likely to be the pro balm here.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[xpatUSA]

That’s true. But if the editing was relatively minor, the histogram would be close. In addition, basic editing rarely compresses a histogram.

Indeed, Dan, but now we're guessing about Bob's post-processing ... that it might have been been relatively minor and that only basic editing was applied.

So I don’t see any indication of the excessive dynamic range that would call for bracketing. Not that it’s impossible, but I think it’s not likely to be the pro balm here.

Like yourself, though, I'm not sure either why Richard brought up bracketing ...

[DanK]

We don’t know what processing was done. However, generally, we look at a posted image and on the basis of what we can see, we make suggestions.my point was only that I don’t see anything that suggests that bracketing would address the issues people have raised about this image.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[xpatUSA]

We don’t know what processing was done.

Correct.

However, generally, we look at a posted image and on the basis of what we can see, we make suggestions.

Indeed we do for what they're worth.

My point was only that I don’t see anything that suggests that bracketing would address the issues people have raised about this image.

I don't either.