Nikon Creative Lighting System (CLS)

[Digital]

I would like to hear from any members who use the Nikon CLS, and what they think of it.
Thanks.

Bruce

[Manfred M]

I would like to hear from any members who use the Nikon CLS, and what they think of it.
Thanks.

Bruce

Out of date technology that belongs in the past.

I haven't used it in years as it does not work well in bright sunlight and needs a line of view between the various sensors when used off-camera (its obvious use).

Radio triggers have made this technology obsolete.

[Digital]

Manfred, thank you for your response.

What radio triggers would you recommend?

Bruce

[Manfred M]

I happen to use PocketWizards, but they are the most expensive ones on the market. The main reason I use the is that they are as close to "universal" as one gets in the radio trigger world and I can use them with both my Nikon flash (including remote control of them) as well as my Paul C Buff studio lights.

There are others out there as well, but cannot make any recommendations as I have not used them.

[dje]

Manfred isn't CLS a general name for Nikon's flash/camera control system? I assume you are referring to optical triggering of off camera flashes being outdated but that's just one part of the system. A radio trigger still uses CLS doesn't it?


https://www.nikonimgsupport.com/eu/B...072&lang=en_GB

Dave

[Manfred M]

Manfred isn't CLS a general name for Nikon's flash/camera control system? I assume you are referring to optical triggering of off camera flashes being outdated but that's just one part of the system. A radio trigger still uses CLS doesn't it?


https://www.nikonimgsupport.com/eu/B...072&lang=en_GB

Dave

In my view and experience there are two key aspects to Nikon's CLS system. The first is the ability to monitor and control the amount of light to get a correct exposure and the second part is the ability to control off-camera flash remotely.

Let me address both aspects of the CLS system. The metering and control of on-camera flash works well and is just as well implemented as it ever was. This is a tool that countless event and wedding photographers use, so its usefulness cannot be understated. That being said, in my experience, it something I continue to use in situations where off-camera flash is not possible; certainly in outdoor fill flash (dial in flash exposure compensation) and bounce flash in "gun & run shooting situations).

Off-camera flash is at the heart of higher end photography; portraiture, still life, fine art, etc. In this sphere, on camera flash is viewed as a necessary evil and attempts are made to emulate what is achieved in off camera flash. Absolutely no question about it, this is how I do the vast majority of my flash photography and the same is true for any flash photographer I know.

This is the aspect of flash photography that CLS is obsolete in; off camera control of flash. My PocketWizards with controller can handle the same three zones my CLS based optical triggers handle. No issues in bright light, no issues with line-of-sight. Remote setting from the top of the camera, etc. I can even tap into in-camera metering with speedlights, if I want to, but frankly I have always gone with manual in this type of shooting because the results are more consistent.

So I might have overstated that CLS is obsolete by a bit, but it really needs to be updated with modern flash trigger technology to be useful. Right now, their SB-5000 is a step in the tight direction with its RF capability, but the rest of the field is still based on optical triggers.

[shreds]

In my view and experience there are two key aspects to Nikon's CLS system. The first is the ability to monitor and control the amount of light to get a correct exposure and the second part is the ability to control off-camera flash remotely.

Let me address both aspects of the CLS system. The metering and control of on-camera flash works well and is just as well implemented as it ever was. This is a tool that countless event and wedding photographers use, so its usefulness cannot be understated. That being said, in my experience, it something I continue to use in situations where off-camera flash is not possible; certainly in outdoor fill flash (dial in flash exposure compensation) and bounce flash in "gun & run shooting situations).

Off-camera flash is at the heart of higher end photography; portraiture, still life, fine art, etc. In this sphere, on camera flash is viewed as a necessary evil and attempts are made to emulate what is achieved in off camera flash. Absolutely no question about it, this is how I do the vast majority of my flash photography and the same is true for any flash photographer I know.

This is the aspect of flash photography that CLS is obsolete in; off camera control of flash. My PocketWizards with controller can handle the same three zones my CLS based optical triggers handle. No issues in bright light, no issues with line-of-sight. Remote setting from the top of the camera, etc. I can even tap into in-camera metering with speedlights, if I want to, but frankly I have always gone with manual in this type of shooting because the results are more consistent.

So I might have overstated that CLS is obsolete by a bit, but it really needs to be updated with modern flash trigger technology to be useful. Right now, their SB-5000 is a step in the tight direction with its RF capability, but the rest of the field is still based on optical triggers.

Like you I use OCF as a preference when studio lighting is not viable or appropriate. I do however still like the lower power and arrangement of small flashguns for smaller macro subjects that the Nikon R1C1 with a number of SB R200s provides.

Pocket Wizards are good too, but could equally be said to be overpriced and outdated when the same functionality can be provided by the YongNuo range of flash lighting. It is indeed good and so cheap, many Pro's I know, have committed their PW to eBay and regard the replacements as a disposable given the low cost.

Godox lighting also has improved dramatically especially for OCF.

Electronics never stands still and is forever changing. One reason why the British Bowens lighting system didn't move with the times and was supplanted.

At the level of Profoto, one moves into the largely professional domain, where the products are highly regarded and are priced accordingly.

[Manfred M]

Like you I use OCF as a preference when studio lighting is not viable or appropriate. I do however still like the lower power and arrangement of small flashguns for smaller macro subjects that the Nikon R1C1 with a number of SB R200s provides.

Pocket Wizards are good too, but could equally be said to be overpriced and outdated when the same functionality can be provided by the YongNuo range of flash lighting. It is indeed good and so cheap, many Pro's I know, have committed their PW to eBay and regard the replacements as a disposable given the low cost.

Godox lighting also has improved dramatically especially for OCF.

Electronics never stands still and is forever changing. One reason why the British Bowens lighting system didn't move with the times and was supplanted.

At the level of Profoto, one moves into the largely professional domain, where the products are highly regarded and are priced accordingly.

Ian to a large extent I agree and that I why I suggested Bruce look at the other trigger makes. It is a lot simpler when dealing with just a single brand of camera / flash. As I use a combination of Paul C Buff and Nikon gear, the PocketWizards let me control both together.

I do use a Godox Witsro AD-360 (original model) and so I do have a couple of Godox triggers (including one that communicates with Nikon cameras) and a "dumb" trigger that I use most of the time, but I have not bought Godox transceivers (I have one Godox studio flash, four Paul C Buff studio flash and two Nikon Speedlights); I have PocketWizard gear that lets me use all four Buff and two Nikon flash simultaneously. If I need the Godox light as well, I can mount it on top of one of my Pocket Wizard Flex TT5 units (I have done this, it does work) or I can fire the Godox using optical slaving (I've done that too).

It really depends on personal needs. I've never used any ProFoto gear; well outside of my price range, but I have used Elinchrome with Skyport technology. Also nice, but outside of my price range.

When I talk to the pros that I know, they are all over the map. I know one that loves his Phottix triggers, another uses cheap no-name Chinese makes that he buys by the fist-full and treats them as disposable. The folks that shoot the brand name flash, tend to stick with either their proprietary solutions or use PocketWizard gear. It would be lovely to have standards, but that isn't likely to happen. My Godox uses Bowens mount and my Buff lights use Balcar mounts; both those companies are now defunct but their light modifier mounts live on...

[Digital]

I have been researching the Godox flash trigger system.
If anyone uses this system, please let me know what you think of it.
Thanks.

Bruce

[dje]

I have been researching the Godox flash trigger system.
If anyone uses this system, please let me know what you think of it.
Thanks.

Bruce

Bruce I have the Sony version of the Godox system, a TT350s flash and an X2Ts wireless trigger, The system works well with my Sony gear. The TT350 has a built in wireless receiver and transmitter so it's a neat system. I can't say how well the Nikon version of the Godox system works I'm afraid.

The only negative with my Godox gear was that my first wireless trigger (an X1Ts) packed it in after a year or so. I guess at the price, you can't expect Rolls Royce reliability!

Dave

[Manfred M]

Bruce - I have both a Godox FT-16S and xPro N trigger. The FT-16S is a "dumb" trigger and the xPro N is a "smart" trigger that interacts with the CLS functionality. I don't have any of the smart receivers that work with the xPro N, just the XTR-16 dumb receiver (in both the 433 mHz and 2.4 GHz models).

The FT-16S is a very basic design and does not feel all that robust. That's why I bought the xPro N, in case the FT-16S gets broken or fails. Operationally the dumb triggers are simple to use and the only problem that I've had with them is that it is far too each to set the group and if the flash is not firing, it is the first place I look on both the transmitter and receiver.

The xPro N is a modern unit and construction seems more solid that the FT-16S. Far more complicated to use than my PocketWizards, but one of these days I will buy a couple of receivers so that I can use them with my Nikon Speedlights.

[William W]

Can one take decent portraits indoors using two reflectors, and a speedlight?

I recently purchased a Sekonic flash meter from B&H.

I would like to hear from CiC members who use a WhiBal card.

What radio triggers would you recommend?

I would like to hear from any members who use the Nikon CLS, and what they think of it.

I have been researching the Godox flash trigger system. If anyone uses this system, please let me know what you think of it.

Considering -

. . . It is a lot simpler when dealing with just a single brand of camera / flash.

And

When I talk to the pros that I know, they are all over the map.

Also

It really depends on personal needs.

Hiya Bruce,

What do you want to achieve? – i.e. can you provide a description of the GENERAL purpose(s) for the kit that you want to build.
What are the specific (or a close to specific) outcomes do you have? – e.g. what Photographic Genre(s); flexibilities of the kit; etc..
What physical situations will you use this kit ? – e.g. Studio or Location?
What’s your budget?
What’s your timeline?

WW

[Digital]

William - I would like to set up an informal portrait studio (right now on location). I plan to use my 2 speedlights to have as a main and fill lights. My genre has been landscape photography mostly. Although I have a past history of doing weddings during the film era. My budget is flexible- I have purchased a lot of items from B&H recently.
I do not have a timeline now- mainly due to Covid-19.

Bruce

[William W]

Thank you.

I've been following all those conversations and I thought an overview of your goals would be useful to harnessing tailored advice and comments toward each question - AND - the mission generally.

WW

[Dave Humphries]

I have been researching the Godox flash trigger system.
If anyone uses this system, please let me know what you think of it.
Thanks.

Bruce

Hi Bruce,

I shoot Godox, specifically - I started in April 2016 with a trigger and one TT685N (Nikon) and over the next year added another TT685N, two TT600 (manual only version), plus a full facility hot-shoe trigger controller, I forget the number as I asked for it as a present, so it's not in my Amazon order history.
From memory, the Nikon compatible auto TT-685N were around 85 GBP each and the TT600 55 GBP.

I have had no equipment failures so far, although my use of them has dropped off in 2019 and 2020.

For my use, mainly indoors (hence close distance), I find the wireless triggering works well, although I recall when shooting in garden once, I could trigger from one end of garden to other, around 35m, or over 100 feet.

Being able to control the power remotely, from top of camera, is brilliant.
I generally shoot all manual control, hence the cheaper TT600 to make up four light set.

Of course, you always seem to need more power, but the range starts to get expensive for the 'more punchy' models, > 200 GBP.
I cannot justify that yet, maybe now I am retired, I will get back in to it, although the current global issues won't help with that!

Cheers,
Dave

[Digital]

Dave, thanks for the information.

Bruce

[Digital]

Using a single flash I took a pic of my Tilley Hat (made in Canada) using my new Godox Flash system.
It worked perfectly.

Bruce

P.S. so does the hat.

[Manfred M]

Using a single flash I took a pic of my Tilley Hat (made in Canada) using my new Godox Flash system.
It worked perfectly.

Bruce

P.S. so does the hat.

I'm still on my first Godox flash (it's about 5 years old) but am on my third Tilley hat; they seem to last about 20 years. The lifetime warranty is great as they replaced each hat that had worn out.

[Digital]

I test fired my second speedlight (SB 910) with the Godox Flash Trigger system. As before it worked perfectly. So far, I have found that this system is easy to use.

Manfred, I am still on my first Tilley hat. I have had it for approximately for 16 years. I have several other Tilley hats; however the tan colored one is my favorite. Lately, I have worn it every day.

Bruce

[shreds]

Just on the subject of remote triggers, a few years ago, we were doing a city centre shoot with a professional model and using wireless triggers. Great, until we tried to do the same with the model at the far end of a long rectangular ornamental pond with a flow of water in it.

Boy did the water upset the radio triggers that failed to function as we planned. In retrospect it is logical that the water could upset the transmission frequencies when beaming along the water.

Has anybody else experienced this phenomenon?