Girl on 34th Street

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Seen this girl yesterday standing and smoking a cigarette on 34th Street. I wanted to take her picture. By the time I had my camera out, she began to walk away. I asked her permission and she smiled and said yes. Not the street photo I wanted. It's posed but I'm good with that. She was standing in front of a huge provocative poster for Victorias Secret. Overall it was too confusing. Went with an extreme crop. I worked the photo the best I could with limited post-processing skills and time. Comments welcomed.

[IMG]Girl on 34th St. by pongo now, on Flickr[/IMG]

[Manfred M]

Having someone wearing dark clothing, shot against a dark background is always a challenge as there is little separation between the subject and the background. The other thing I really notice are all the distractions; the lines in the poster, the floor and the red and the tile patterns on the poster.

I would suggest an even more aggressive crop to remove the distractions and a bit of patch work to remove the lines behind your subject.

[escape]

Thank you Manfred for your critique. I would consider removing the two lines. For me, the rest is integral to the composition of a girl on the street.

[Manfred M]

For me, the rest is integral to the composition of a girl on the street.

Sure, if you feel that the bottom of the image is integral to your composition, do include it.

Let me tell you why I cropped the way I did. This crop is referred to as a 3/4 view and is quite common in portraiture. It has the advantage of getting closer to the subject's face, which is usually the most important part of the image. Legs and feet tend to push the subject further back, which means the photographer often needs an important reason to include these parts of the body.

The other issue is that the background area; the floor and areas of the poster are distracting. The human visual system is cued to bright areas and areas of high contrast and our eyes will tend to go there. If this is not the subject, then these areas will act as distractions. This is certainly the case of the lines near your subjects head. It is also the case for the flooring and the red and black & white areas on the poster.

When I first started working on this image, I tried to preserve your composition and I burned down those bright areas and desaturated the red to see how this looked. In my view, I did not find that the result worked, so I moved on to the crop.

Trying Googling the work "Portraits" and look at the images that pop up. The majority are likely to be head shots or head and chest shots. There will be fewer 3/4 shots and full body shots that show the legs. I do include legs in my own portraiture, if they play an important role in the composition; dancers, for instance, interesting leg wear and / or footwear, etc. I will also include them when the legs are more compact, i.e. the subject is sitting. They also can work well in group shots.

[Geoff F]

This image does look better in the lightbox view where more of the fine detail is apparent; but even then, I am distracted by all that red in the lower part of the scene. Maybe if that area was toned down, as Manfred mentioned, there would be more merit in the full length portrait idea? Also, possibly reduce the space at the bottom so her feet are a little closer to the frame edge?

[escape]

Thank you, Geoff and Manfred. Your comments made me think about this photo in new ways.

[Dave Humphries]

Hi Daniel,

I concur with Manfred's comments and reasoning.

For me, the 'take-away' is that we should all strive to mentally identify 'the subject' before we take (almost) any shot, then pre-visualise a suitable background - and make that happen, or if that's not possible, at least look through-the-viewfinder/at-the-LCD and arrange the composition, perspective and viewpoint to emphasize the subject and reduce all distractions (perhaps the latter to the point where cloning in PP is easier).

Of course, I appreciate that remembering all this when out is hard, but is worth practising to train ourselves to take better shots in-camera. Add to that the stress of having successfully asked a stranger to briefly pose (well done on that btw) and I know what I say is easier said than done, but we're here to learn and I hope these thoughts benefit both yourself and others reading the thread. I know they'll benefit me too, reiterating in 'print' helps me retain the information too.

Also, it's possible you shot a much wider frame where the poster/billboard behind was a legitimate part of the composition, but as that didn't work out, once you decided to crop down and make the woman alone the subject, then you arguably needed to reassess what is 'now' the subject (and reduce/remove distractions).

Personally, I find that snapping while out rarely results in good images, I have to be in-the-mood, which practically speaking means I have to set out specifically to take photos - with a camera & lens appropriate for the subject and plenty of time. Then I can prepare by finding a suitable places to shoot from, with complimentary backgrounds, a good direction of light angles, steady stream of subjects, etc. be these birds in flight/on lake - or even folks passing by. The latter is something I rarely shoot, if you're interested, my people gallery is here, although as you can see from the dates, it has not been updated in years.

The coloured/mono shots with palms were shot on holiday in Tenerife and I sat on a sidewalk seat with a chosen framing of tree trunks and let the folks walk or cycle past me, snapping when they by, apart from the girl with bag (5778 - awaiting her partner) and for that one you can see the various crops (ed1-ed3) that resulted in the final image. The PP isn't great, forgive the edges caused by my sharpening regime back then.

The band shots were taken at an event and I had to shuffle around the grass on my bum/butt in front of a standing/seated audience, shooting up to (mostly) avoid the activity in the other end of the tent with all its brightly coloured distractions (see 29108).

For the swimming ones, part of a Triathlon, I had to get out at 6am for the start - but that gave me plenty of practise.

All the best,
Dave

[Manfred M]

+1 to Dave's comments. Like him, I find that "grab shots" rarely work out as strongly as one would wish. I've found that there is a strong link between a slow and deliberate approach and capturing strong images.

When I teach landscape or still life photography, I recommend that people shoot with a tripod. While it does take away the variable of camera movement, the most important advantage of using a tripod is that it forces the photographer to slow down. I have a friend who shoots with a 4 x 5 view camera and he jokes that burst mode for him is 2 images per hour.

While a tripod is impractical for the types of shots you do, slowing down and being deliberate in your actions is still good advice. Grabbing a shot on the way to work or to catch a bus is always going to mean that the primary aim of your being out will overwhelm your ability to capture a strong image.

Another go way to learn is to study what other strong photographers have done. Have a look at the works of the "masters" like Henri Cartier-Bresson, Diane Arbus, Elliot Erwitt, Gary Winograd and Vivian Meier to name a few well known street photographers. All of these folks used fairly basic film cameras (when compared to today's smart phones) and still managed to capture some amazing images.

If you want to see what a strong contemporary street photographer does, look at Zack Arias; he has done some very good work in the NYC area.

[escape]

Hello David and Manfred. Sorry it took me a while to respond to your posts. I agree with your comments and assessments. I always bring my camera when I'm downtown. When something strikes me, I take a picture. Yes, they usually aren't worth saving. But on occasions, I capture a moment or something that pleases me. I sent this photo to my daughter, who has an art background, to see her thoughts. She echoed Manfred's assessment. She edited the photo on her phone, smoothing out the background, and sharpening the subject. She also reduced the sidewalk. It was an improvement. Despite its flaws, I like it.

I have been thinking of setting up my shots. Last month I purchased a small, lightweight folding tripod seat. I want to set up my camera on a tripod, sit, and watch. I'm going to operate the camera from my cell phone.
I'm also now thinking of taking portraits of strangers in the street. I never really thought of it that way. One thing I have learned when you tell people you are a photographer, they give you consent. When I asked the girl on 34th street, I also hand her my card. It adds some legitimacy to the request. What surprised me most was her response. Her eyes widened, a big smile came across her face, and she looked delighted. A mystery to me. My daughter said she was probably flattered to have a photographer stop her and ask for her photo.

This past spring, I took a day trip upstate NY. I planned to photograph every person I spoke to that day. Because of the pandemic, only a few—a woman in overalls at a gas station and some store clerks. I think if your asking strangers to take their picture, a business card goes a long way. I may have digressed a bit, but perhaps someone will find this useful.

[Manfred M]

My "art background" is relatively new; something I have acquired over the past decade of so. My formal education background is technical. I am amused / pleased that your daughter agrees with my assessment. Perhaps she could speak with my daughters; they rarely agree with me, if nothing other than principle...

I strongly suspect that if you slow down and consider the shot more carefully, your percentage of "keepers" will improve.

I don't go the business card route, it seems to formal to me, although I have thought about printing some up from time to time. I usually just ask or point my camera at someone. If they shake their head no, I don't take the shot. If they are okay with it, then I take their picture. Sometimes I operate in pure "stealth" mode in order to get a purely candid shot.

Both techniques work, but end up with totally different shots. I do most of my street photography when I travel. At home I tend to shoot more formally in either the studio or on location, usually with proper lighting equipment and someone to work with, often a model. I apply some of my studio techniques of coaching and posing the models in some of my street photography.

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g.

For me, the 'take-away' is that we should all strive to mentally identify 'the subject' before we take (almost) any shot, then pre-visualize a suitable background - and make that happen,

Dave, I found your advice to be very helpful. ( Previsualize, then make that happen.) A lot there to explore. Thank you, Daniel