Canson Paper

[LenR]

Canson Baryta Photographique has been one of my papers of choice for some years.
Unfortunately, as many printers are aware, this version has now been discontinued.
I would be interested to learn if any forum members have tried the replacement BarytaII paper and what impressions they have.
Thanks.

[DanK]

I have. The original Canson Baryta Photographique was my most-used paper for serious printing. The dynamic range and color reproduction of the new paper are very similar to the original. The new paper handles a bit better. However, it has a different, flatter surface that I don’t particularly care for.


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[LenR]

Dan, appreciate your comments. I understand the new paper is an alpha cellulose/fibre rag combo. I still have 3 unopened boxes of the original (13x19) but should probably give the new version a look see.

[DanK]

It might be. I don't recall seeing anything about a rag/alpha cellulose mix, and the packaging doesn't say.

I've used about 20 sheets of the new version. In my printer (Prograf 1000), the difference in handling is not really noticeable, but this printer handles flat papers from the rear tray very well. I would consider the two versions interchangeable if it weren't for the surface, which is very different. The old paper was labeled a luster paper, but I considered it a satin, in that the stippling was extremely shallow. The new paper is more like a semi-gloss. The surface is slightly scored, but it isn't really stippled. One result is that it is considerably more reflective, particularly at an angle. I loved the original paper, so I really tried to like the replacement, but I still don't.

Manfred and I both looked at a lot of replacements. I didn't find anything that is really a good match to the original. Some barytas are too warm for me, and others are too high in OBAs. In the end, I narrowed it down to two papers. One is Canson Platine, which isn't a baryta but is quite similar to the original Canson Baryta, but slightly more stippled and I think a bit less lively. The other is Breathing Color River Stone Satin Rag, which is "baryta style"--a microporous paper but not made with barium sulfate. They are quite similar, but the River Stone has a little more pop. On the other hand, it's an OBA-free paper, and while it is cooler than most, it's a tad warmer than the Canson barytas, which are "very low" in OBA content. I'll probably use the River Stone for the most part, although I may use Platine or even Baryta II when I want a colder paper.

[LenR]

Dan, thanks for the additional input. It is a pity that Canson discontinued the original baryta. I started using the paper about the time when Ilford discontinued Gallerie Gold Fibre Silk, also a baryta which had been my previous paper of choice. I have tried the Platine and agree with your comment that it is less "lively" I also print on Ilford Gallerie Gold Fibre Gloss, a newer paper in the Ilford range. A coated 100% cotton rag paper which I quite like. Similar surface texture to the Platine but somewhat warmer and with a wider gamut. The River Stone papers are new to me but could bear looking into.
Thanks again.

[Manfred M]

Like Dan, I used the original Baryta Photographique as my lustre paper. I'm out of 13 x 19, but still have 8-1/2 x 11. 17 x 22 and most of a 50ft roll of 17" paper.

Like Dan, I don't love the surface texture of the new Canson Baryata Photographique II paper either. I don't have the same issues with OBAs that Dan does. I've started using Hahnemühle Silk Baryta as my "go to" luster paper. I like the coolness of the paper as well as the surface. I've also tried Hahnemühle Gloss Baryta and Canson Platine Fibre Rag. I find that the Platine surface is a bit too delicate, but is an interesting paper that I should find a place for as well.

I print on an Epson P800 and use a number of Epson branded papers when I am looking for a matte surface (Primariy Hot Press Bright a lot of my work, but Hot Press Natural for portraits).

[DanK]

Len,

Breathing Color is a small company, I think, in Austin TX. I hadn't heard of them until a bunch of people started posting on other forums about what they were going to use after the change in Canson Baryta. A few mentioned River Stone, and one said that he had stopped looking at other papers once he found it. So, I figured, why not give it a look? It's not all that widely available, so I ordered directly from Breathing Color.

They have lots of other papers as well, but I haven't looked at those.

River Stone is an unusual paper. It's coated and printable on both sides. I have no idea why they do this, as I don't know who would print archival quality prints double sided. It makes the paper very stiff. The sample they sent me was unfortunately a roll, and my printer doesn't use rolls and therefore has a paper feeding mechanism isn't set up for highly curled paper. it took me a while to cut pieces and get them sufficiently flattened. I don't know what the surface is--it's proprietary--but it creates a very nice, vibrant image.

Re OBAs: I'm guessing that you have already read more than you wanted to about it. I have no problem using papers with OBAs for casual printing. I was always a bit uncomfortable using them for serious printing, but I accepted the small amount in Canson Baryta. I didn't want to go for more than that. There are two problems with OBA, IMHO. One is that they are dyes, and like all other dyes, they fade. From what I have read, how quickly they fade depends on how they are added to the surface, but good luck getting information on that. The other problem is that prints on high-OBA paper look quite different under different types of lighting because the OBAs flouresce under UV light. You can see this clearly by placing a sheet of UV-protective glass over half a print. This had me dithering for a long time because I prefer the look of a cold white paper, and that usually means a hefty dose of OBAs. Platine is an exception: it's a pretty cold paper with no OBAs. Canson Rag Photographique is a matte paper that also is very cold with no OBAs. River Stone is not as cold as the Canson paper, but it isn't as warm as many other OBA-free papers.

[Manfred M]

It's coated and printable on both sides. I have no idea why they do this, as I don't know who would print archival quality prints double sided.

Table top photo books that are custom bound tends to be the use of these papers, although it does sound like the paper might be a be a bit too heavy for that use.

[DanK]

It might work with some sort of hinged binding, but the paper doesn't flex very well.

In any case, I don't print my own photo books--that's one of the few things I don't print myself--so my concern was only what a single-side print looks like. I spent a lot of time and ink comparing both a test image and real images on a bunch of different papers, and that one rose to the top.

They sell a wide range of papers for painters and print makers as well as photographers, and they have more uncoated papers than coated ones, but I print on matte papers so rarely that I haven't yet explored any of theirs.

[LenR]

Thanks to Dan & Manfred for their contributions to this thread.